Jatha- Is It Just Like Caste?

[akal sahai]

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

Today I have just been listening to Giani Sant Singh Ji Maskeen's Katha on taking Amrit - WAHEGUROO, WAHEGUROO, WAHEGUROO... i had stop doing everything and jus listen to the Katha >>> it was soooo amazing!!!

I don't know where I downloaded it from - so sorry i can't give a link.

A nutshell this is what Giani Ji was saying.

QUOTEAsking questions and being inquisitive about your religion is nothing to fear. When youngsters ask questions on the need of Amrit, and wearing the 5Ks then that can be a healthy thing. For Guru Sahib encourages us to use our "akal", our intellect, our logic to make sense of things. (AklI swihbu syvIAY AklI pweIAY mwnu ] - Ang 1245)

Giani Ji was once asked by someone:

Person asks:

Guru Nanak Sahib rejected wearing religious symbols. He disregarded wearing the "Jannoo" (hindu sacred thread). However Guru Gobind Singh Ji gives us the 5 Ks, which are 5 religious symbols. Isn't there a contradiction there?

Giani Ji responds:

Do you know what the "jannoo" is? Why do people wear it and its significance?

Person replies:

No!

Giani Ji says:

Then my friend, you need to understand what the Jannoo is about before comparing it to the 5 Ks.

Guru Nanak Sahib when rejecting to wear the Jannoo at the age of 9 years old, he asked the Pandit a question. "Why should I wear the Jannoo. And if I do not wear the Jannoo, then what will happen?"

The Pandit replied that wearing the Jannoo you distinguish yourself as a Brahman, Kathri or Vaish (high castes). However, if you do not put on the Jannoo then you will regarded as a Shoodar (low caste).

(Note: There is a different style of threat (different knotted thread) to distinguish between who is a Brahman, who is a Khatri and who is a Vaishav).

This is clear discrimination. Guru Sahib rejects this.

Son! Do you agree with me that by looking at one's five K's you cannot distinguish that he is a Jatt! he is a Paapa! He is a Brahman. No!

The 5Ks have been blessed upon everyone equally. Whether a Brahman, Jatt, Shoodar, Paapa or anyone wishes to take Amrit, then all of them wear the 5 Ks which are not associated or mark any inferiority, superioirty or difference.

When recieving Amrit - all the initiates drink out of the same bowl. Thus abolishing all thought, distiniction and mark of caste or difference. They show that they are all equal.

Now do you understand that the 5 Ks do not divide people, the Guru has given them to us to unite and make people ONE.

fateh i read this post on another website and had a thought. Here the person who posted said that the 5 ks dont divide people, but i have across many sikhs who say i aint wearing that kirpan cus its of that jatha, or im wearing it this way cus its the way jatha where it.

Have we got involved with our jatheh so much that we lost the principles of sikhi...........

[Anonymous_kaur]

:WW:

veerji...is dere ny chance u can provide us wiv a link to the katha..or ny of Giani Sant Singh Ji Maskeen's videos/audios ??

[Guest G.Kaur]

:WW:

veerji...is dere ny chance u can provide us wiv a link to the katha..or ny of Giani Sant Singh Ji Maskeen's videos/audios ??

Giani Sant Singh Ji Maskeen's katha

http://www.sikhee.com/audio/sikhee.php?q=f...ingh+Ji+Maskeen

http://www.maskeensahib.com/

http://www.keertan.org/andromeda.php?q=f&a...ngh+Jee+Maskeen

http://www.longislandkeertan.com/keertan.p...ingh+ji+Maskeen

http://www.gurbaniupdesh.org/multimedia/li...ingh+Maskeen+Ji

Videos

http://www.sikhee.com/video/sikhee.php?q=f...t+Singh+Maskeen

[akal sahai]

so has jathabandia become like caste....

[dasmesh_regiment]

yes it has. sad really.

[Laadli Fauj]

not really

jus like warring tribes

caste implies order and social hierarchy

jatha bashing is jus feudal warfare, not caste at all

[rupinder singh]

In my view in the UK when you refer to jatha one mainly means the Akhand Kirtan Jatha. I don't think anyone else practices a strict adherance to their Jatha as much as is practiced in the AKJ of today. Certainly people who have allegiances to other groups tend to be more inclusive however there seems to be more exclusivity in the AKJ youth than youth who affiliate to Taksaal, Sants or Dals. So in short an indiscreet "caste" system in practiced within "the Akhand Kirtan Jatha" as a pose to Jathas/Groups in general.

Note. I am basing my opinion on my experiences. Other's may hold a different view.

[xHarinder_singh]

I feel the word 'jatha' in sikhi means a group of gursikhs collectively working to perform a certain task. So there is nuthing wrong in having jathas in the panth.

The AKJ was started by Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh Jee and his fellow gursikhs to do parchar of gurmat rehits like keski, sarbloh bibek and to bring back naam drirh back into the panth. I myself was greatly inspired by life and gursikhi jeevan of Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh Jee and feel that he was one of the best gursikhs ever to be born into the sikh panth. But with time, the people in the AKJ began to leave the very rehits for which the AKJ was formed. As a result, ego, hankaar , lack of love for fellow amritdharis, took birth and the degeneration of the jatha began.

Having said that, there are still some very charrdi kala sub groups within AKJ who keep good rehit and are great singhs but as a whole, the present "AKJ" is not the jatha that was started by Dhan Dhan Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh Jee.

[Guru_Da_Chella]

hmm jathas, as in these organisations.

someseem to have their own rehits. Some have gone even further for example views on bani and even kakkars.

Many use a jatha name like caste is used. For example you will see this on event leaflets.

ALso they seem to have come about in british raj times, and lineage before this time is questionable.

[Bored]

what other "jathas" are there besides akj ?

came some1 name then all?

thanks