Nanaksahi Calendar

[S1ngh]

wjkk wjkf

I used to give 100% support to Nanaksahi calendar created by Mr. Purewal but now i am having second thoughts about this. In my personal opinion Bikrami Calendar was good enough for our community and it was being used by our forefathers. The only reason i started supporting Nanaksahi calendar because i believed that that bikrami calendar is hindu system based calendar which i think it is not. Few questions:

1) What is the authority or Research Mr. Purewal did that the Tohra/SGPC and others decided to put this calendar in our kaum? What is the background of Purewal? All i know is that he is from Canada with no research background.

2) Who were consulted before agreeing to use this calendar and what were the reasons for having a totally different calendar? Akal Takht Basic SGPC rehat maryada was accepted by majority of jathabandees before it was released to public and it took years...

3) If sangat accepted this calendar then why sangat around the globe celebrate vaisakhi on April 13th instead of 30th, which is official date of vaisakhi in Nanaksahi calendar.

just few thoughts going thru my mind this morning...

wjkk wjkf

[BhForce]

A few thoughts:

1. It's certainly within the power of the panth to decide on minor administrative matters like dates on which to celebrate a Gurpurb.

2. But such a decision should only be made be made with complete agreement. The decision for Nanakshahi calendar wasn't made unanimously. The calendar had been help up for a long time, finally the SGPC just took a majority vote of the calendar committee.

3. The use of the word "Nanakshahi" is somewhat unfair. The word was in use before Purewal's calendar was put into place to simply denote years from the year of Guru Nanak Ji's birth based on the Bikrami calendar.

The use of Guru Nanak Ji's name for a calendar devised by Mr Purewal is unfortunate. It should be called the Purewali calendar.

4. The fact that the Bikrami dates are decided on a non-deterministic basic by Pandits in UP is indeed a problem. So let's not pretend that all is fine and well with Bikrami. But it could have been address with mere reform of that calendar.

5. There was no rush to get a new calendar in. They could have taken up to 10 years, even. What was the rush? Given that we have so many divisions from the last 50 years, did we really need another one like this at this time?

6. The claim that a different calendar will give Sikhs a unique identity is farcical. The fact is, no one uses this calendar for their daily business, unlike Muslims who do use Hijri calendar.

The reason is because there have been many Nanakshahi calendars, and now there's going to be a slightly revised one. No one is going to run his affairs according to a calendar that can be changed on a committee's whim.

[apnepart2]

I read somewhere Bikrami calendar is based on lunar cycle whereas Nanakshahi is based on Solar cycle. It wont go out of date or get totally mixed up on dates after a few centuries. Also i think Tohra did not consult or have a meeting with anyone esp. Hazur Sahib and Patna Sahib before making it official. He thought he was supreme and forgot other people have egos too. in my opinion before making a seperate calendar efforts should have been made to classify Sikhs as a seperate religious people in Indian Constitution and have seperate marriage act. Sikhs have stupid leadership for long time and matters does not improve as many still see themselves as Hindus still in my opinion. There is a bodi in many jooras.lol

[AK47 JATHA LION]

. in my opinion before making a seperate calendar efforts should have been made to classify Sikhs as a seperate religious people in Indian Constitution and have seperate marriage act. Sikhs have stupid leadership for long time and matters does not improve as many still see themselves as Hindus still in my opinion.

Ironically the acceptance of the Nanakshahi calendar could have been a step towards a seperate identity.

At least then sikhs could have said , "we sikhs also have our own seperate calendar". or "sikhs dont rely on Pundits to set their calendar dates" . coulda used it as another arguing point against the constitution stoopid article 25.

[BhForce]

. in my opinion before making a seperate calendar efforts should have been made to classify Sikhs as a seperate religious people in Indian Constitution and have seperate marriage act. Sikhs have stupid leadership for long time and matters does not improve as many still see themselves as Hindus still in my opinion.

Ironically the acceptance of the Nanakshahi calendar could have been a step towards a seperate identity.

At least then sikhs could have said , "we sikhs also have our own seperate calendar". coulda used it as another arguing point against the constitution stoopid article 25.

Well, the Purewali (aka Nanakshahi) calendar is in force now, and it hasn't helped getting rid of article 25.

[apnepart2]

. in my opinion before making a seperate calendar efforts should have been made to classify Sikhs as a seperate religious people in Indian Constitution and have seperate marriage act. Sikhs have stupid leadership for long time and matters does not improve as many still see themselves as Hindus still in my opinion.

Ironically the acceptance of the Nanakshahi calendar could have been a step towards a seperate identity.

At least then sikhs could have said , "we sikhs also have our own seperate calendar". or "sikhs dont rely on Pundits to set their calendar dates" . coulda used it as another arguing point against the constitution stoopid article 25.

i am not against nankshahi calendar. if tohra had talked to committees of hazur sahib and patna sahib before implementing it then there would have been no problems. although they might have rejected it outright then even coz they lean more towards brahmans.

Well, the Purewali (aka Nanakshahi) calendar is in force now, and it hasn't helped getting rid of article 25.

why are you calling it like that? i have not seen you calling bikrami calendar as 'brahmani calendar' which it rightfully is. What has 'Brahmani Calendar' done for Sikhs except re-inforcing the age old cry of Brahmans that Sikhs are Hindus. If a step has been taken forward there is no shortage of people in our quam who take twenty back. If sant Samaj is okay with a Hindu Calendar prepared by Hindus, then it look really stupid and ignorant to oppose Hindu Sages like Ashutosh in Punjab. Sant Samaj is apparently clueless on how to lead so IMO they should keep quiet and as someone said 'should stay away from politics'.

[BhForce]

I am for unanimity and oppose unilateral changes which increase divisiveness for no pressing reason. To change the status quo should require unanimous consent, and that has been the Khalsa way.

The current Nanakshahi calendar was implemented with a simple majority vote.

As I said above, the seasonal shift problems perceived by Mr. Purewal in the current calendar would occur over thousands of years, so it was not a pressing problem.

Well, the Purewali (aka Nanakshahi) calendar is in force now, and it hasn't helped getting rid of article 25.

why are you calling it like that? i have not seen you calling bikrami calendar as 'brahmani calendar' which it rightfully is.

The reason I called the calendar developed by Mr. Purewal "the Purewali calendar" is, as I explained above, his calendar is not the only one which has taken Guru Nanak Ji's birth year as year zero. If you look in old books and magazine, sometimes you'll find a reference to Nanakshahi dates and also Samvat Khalsa (Khalsa year).

So for Mr. PS Purewal to claim the "Nanakshahi" designation only for his calendar isn't quite right.

And like I mentioned before, there have been even a couple of Purewali calendars. They printed one, and then they changed it, this is just to be clear.

As for Bikrami, I don't think there is any other calendar based on King Bikramjit.

What has 'Brahmani Calendar' done for Sikhs except re-inforcing the age old cry of Brahmans that Sikhs are Hindus. If a step has been taken forward there is no shortage of people in our quam who take twenty back. If sant Samaj is okay with a Hindu Calendar prepared by Hindus, then it look really stupid and ignorant to oppose Hindu Sages like Ashutosh in Punjab. Sant Samaj is apparently clueless on how to lead so IMO they should keep quiet and as someone said 'should stay away from politics'.

apne, I'm not really opposed to a modified calendar if that's what the panth wants to do on a united basis. And I've already acknowledged certain problems in the calculation of dates in the Bikrami calendar.

I do, however, want to oppose certain modes of argument being advanced by advocates of Mr. PS Purewal's calendar.

Is the argument "What has 'Brahmani Calendar' done for Sikhs" supposed to be a general format for reasoning?

A calendar is a method for reckoning time, just as the metre is used for reckoning distance, and litres for capacity.

As everyone knows, the French came up with metres, and litres, and kilograms.

So, if we use the same units of measure, are we going to be absorbed into the Christians?

In Paris, France, there is a piece of metal which is called theinternational kilogram prototype at the Bureau International des Poids et Mesures. It is the basis for measure of mass on this Earth. Every country has a copy of that kilogram mass. In turn, each state or province has its own copy.

Each state in India (where most of the Sikh population lives) has a copy of the kilogram, and each district has its own copy with the department of weights and measures.

These kilogram masses were prepared by Christians and Hindus. If they had a hand in preparing a standard for measurement, are Sikhs going to be absorbed into them if they also use it?

Finally, the Bikrami calendar is not based on some Vedic event like the coming of the Aryans, the descent of Shiv, or something like that. It is based on an Indian king called Bikramjit. Granted, people involved in doing the calendar calculations may be Hindus, but the how is the calendar itself Hindu?

In conclusion, if the panth wants to go for a reformed calendar, or a totally new one, that's fine, but let's not do it on the basis of ill-founded thinking.

[mohinder pal]

Why didnot Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj changed the Calendar. Even Satguruji must have thought to bring seperate sikh identity.

Bhai Gurdassji mentioned that Guru Nank Dev ji born on Katak di Pooranmaashi; and today we celebrate on diff. days(1day before or after); thats just stupidity. we should know that Our Sikh Dates are on Thittes(Thit di Vaar by Bahgat Kabeerji and Raag Aasa Mehla 1 in Kirtan Sohila).

Remember my words, Whenever you go out to clean the world, you first start by cleaning your house. Thats what would happen once Satguruji would come on this earth. Satguruji would clean the sikh religion first and then shall go out to clean the world.

Hukam pahl na Sakenge, Bahut khange Maar(Sau Sakhi da Bachan by Guru Gobind singh ji).

[BhForce]

There are two calendars which are based on on the birth year of Hazrat Isa (Jesus): Julian Christian calendar and Gregorian Christian calendar. The reason they aren't simply called "Christian" calendars is to clarify which one.

The names of the calendars are taken from the names of their creators: Julius Caesar and Pope Gregory.

Similarly, the name of the Purewali Nanakshahi calendar is taken from its creator, Er. PS Purewal, to distinguish it from other Nanakshahi calendars.

Now, the question before us, is: does the Sikh panth have the right to question PS Purewal? Does it have the right to make modifications in the Purewali calendar?

[apnepart2]

Why didnot Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj changed the Calendar. Even Satguruji must have thought to bring seperate sikh identity.

Bhai Gurdassji mentioned that Guru Nank Dev ji born on Katak di Pooranmaashi; and today we celebrate on diff. days(1day before or after); thats just stupidity. we should know that Our Sikh Dates are on Thittes(Thit di Vaar by Bahgat Kabeerji and Raag Aasa Mehla 1 in Kirtan Sohila).

Remember my words, Whenever you go out to clean the world, you first start by cleaning your house. Thats what would happen once Satguruji would come on this earth. Satguruji would clean the sikh religion first and then shall go out to clean the world.

Hukam pahl na Sakenge, Bahut khange Maar(Sau Sakhi da Bachan by Guru Gobind singh ji).

why didn't guru gobind singh wear pants and three button british style coats? did he tie the turban mahority of sikhs tie today? why didnt guru gobind singh have a british, american or canadian passport? why didnt guru gobind singh drive a four wheel car? did he visit harmanar sahib and did ishnan in sarovar as all sikhs pray in ardas? satguruji isnt coming anymore. and we do have a satguru to verify please visit your nearest gurdwara.

and bhforce, guru nanak isnt going to fax a calendar from heaven so ultimately some human is gonna produce it. and a few self styled sants are not sikh panth. It became clear in ludhiana when more sikhs were in presence of wise sage Ashutosh than with them.

In conclusion, if the panth wants to go for a reformed calendar, or a totally new one, that's fine, but let's not do it on the basis of ill-founded thinking.

sant Samaj is not sikh panth. they sound more like arya samaj.