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Is Krishna The Most Supreme God Worshipped In Guru Granth Sahib Also ?

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SevaSimran jee how'd you treat someone who steals your sisters' clothes causing them to have to come out naked from the pond ?

Dear...Don't ask or say anything him/her.... we don't know who is he/she.... I think He is just trying to provoke others or just creating disturbance on this forum.. We should ignore him/her....... some Hindu/shivsena campaigns are admitted to this work..

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(In reply to panthicunity)

Good question. Well, if they were a regular mortal I would be very angry. But if that person was blue, obviously not a normal human being, and caused my sister to feel transcendental ecstasy in the process I would probably be OK with it. In fact, anyone who would be around to hear about such a scene would probably feel that same transcendental bliss because Lord Krsna is involved. 'My Sister' would be madly in love with Sri Krsna, and any activities she got to exchange with Him would be on the highest spiritual platform. This is a very deep subject, not to be easily understood by mere speculation, especially in regards to our normal human activities. These women who had their clothes stolen by Krsna were the greatest of devotees who had spent countless lifetimes perfecting their devotion and service unto Him in order to be able to have pastimes with Him. They were not just ordinary girls. They were Spirit Souls, as all of us are, but in female bodies so that they could express their deep love and compassion for Him. It is true that these girls loved no one more than their dear Krsna. They would literally do anything for Him and in return He has wonderful loving exchanges with them in a very playful yet transcendental way.

The book from which this story comes from entitled 'Krsna' or the last canto of Srimad Bhagavatam is considered very confidential literature. It is so because we too easily fall into the trap of comparing Krsna's activities with our mundane human activities. For this reason it is seriously advised by the author that one should first read Bhagavad Gita, and then the preceding cantos of Srimad Bhagavatam to gain full understanding of Sri Krsna's activities in the last canto. This is for our benefit, so that we do not see Lord Krishna as mundane flesh and blood, but truly for who He is as transcendental and fully spiritual, not under the spell of Maya. We also realize from reading these earlier cantos and Bhagavad Gita As It Is, that all of those Souls who incarnated at the time of Krishna and were blessed to have interactions with Him, were indeed the most elevated souls and dearest devotees of The Lord. They had spent countless lifetimes perfecting their service for Him. Sri Krsna is said to be all-attractive, meaning He is the most attractive and the most beautiful. As Guru Nanak writes 'He is adorned with garlands of flowers, with lotus eyes'. Anyone who even caught a glimpse of Krishna during this time felt amazing transcendental ecstasy.

The best way for us to be able to come closer in our loving relationship with The Lord is to chant His Holy Names. Guru Nanak has said: ਜਗੰਨਾਥੁ ਗੋਪਾਲੁ ਮੁਖਿ ਭਣੀ ॥

The Lord of the Universe, the Lord of the world; with my mouth, I chant His Name.

A few of His names that we can chant are Gopala Govinda Rama, Madana Mohana. There are no hard and fast rules for chanting these names, and they can be added to any spiritual practice. They are universal and non-sectarian. We can sing these beautiful names, or we can chant silently to ourselves on our Japa beads.

Thank you again for your question Ji.

Haribol Spirit Souls~

Seva Simran

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Dear...Don't ask or say anything him/her.... we don't know who is he/she.... I think He is just trying to provoke others or just creating disturbance on this forum.. We should ignore him/her....... some Hindu/shivsena campaigns are admitted to this work..

Dear Sir, I am not posting here to provoke or disturb. My intention is simply to point out what your dear Guru Nanak has already said. I am not Hindu or 'Shivsena', for Guru Nanak Himself says "There is neither Hindu nor Mussulman (Muslim) so whose path shall I follow? I shall follow God's path. God is neither Hindu nor Mussulman and the path which I follow is God's." Ek Ong Kar ~ One Creator made this Creation. I am following the path of love for God, as Guru Nanak and many others did.

Guru Nanak taught that we should chant and remember God's Holy Name or Naam. We remember the story of Nanak traveling to God's court and drinking the amrita. God then spoke to Nanak: "This is the cup of the adoration of God's name. Drink it. I am with you. I bless you and raise you up. Whoever remembers you will enjoy My favour. Go, rejoice of My Name and teach others to do so. I have bestowed the gift of My Name upon you. Let this be your calling."

Is this not a basic principle or tenet of Sikhism? Let us come together to chant and remember God's Name. The names which I have been given are that of Krishna, Rama and Hari. It appears that Guru Nanak was a dear lover of Krishna, in remembering his pastimes and singing His glories. Shall we not do the same?

Remember, there is One God with many Names.

Haribol Spirit Souls~

Seva Simran

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Seva Simran

Everyone is objecting to your inability to truthfully speak on Gurbani. You have a slanted opinion to favor a devta that was nothing more than a devta. He was not the supreme being, but is a beggar at the feet of Vaheguru's Bhagats. Krishna made mistakes and these mistakes are written in Gurbani. Supreme Being does not make mistakes.

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Everyone is objecting to your inability to truthfully speak on Gurbani. You have a slanted opinion to favor a devta that was nothing more than a devta. He was not the supreme being, but is a beggar at the feet of Vaheguru's Bhagats. Krishna made mistakes and these mistakes are written in Gurbani. Supreme Being does not make mistakes.

You are right, I know very little on Gurbani. I am only speaking from the topic of this thread, the original lines that were quoted, my personal knowledge of vedanta coming from revealed scriptures and Guru, and a few extra quotes/historical references on Guru Nanak that I know. I simply thought an outside perspective might be healthy for all of us, as the topic pertains to Krishna whom Sikhs generally make little mention of (that I am aware of). If both sides are not willing to listen to each other and the points that are made, there is no purpose in continuing a conversation.

I hope what has been said has not fallen on deaf ears.

Namaste Souls,

Seva Simran

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Just quickly dropping by, few things out of the way, this is based on my research-
1. Gurmat does not worship any avtars but only akaal purkh. We don't confine akaal purkh to different avtars (including prevalent six of them) as from advait gurmat and also advait vedanta esteroric gyan layer everything is OM, Ik0ngkar one universal consciousness..so if everything is one in bhramgyan and non transcendental meditation (sun samadhi)... nothing is perceived higher or lower as only oneness (ikongkar) all in one, one in all is perceived at the ultimate bhramgyan stage.
2. Gurmat acknowledge and respect/praised not worship (mistake of confine akaal purkh to only avtars) but acknowledge and respect metaphysics of avtar. Akaal purkh while being ajooni akaal moorat imanents its attributes to sarguna (nit, avnit, puran hari avtars etc) to uphold, spread dharma and uproot tryanny, in this case sri krishan maharaj who was bhramgyani karak gurmukh as he was sixteen kala avtar with all the qualities see attachment below and gurbani .
Overall make no mistake they don't come from satan but appear from akaal purkh and disappear in akaal purkh himself according to need and time, yes they goof up but thats also according to akaal purkh hakum as there is no such thing as free will, its all his tamasha..Some are given higher powers and some are lower powers (kala) to propagate dharam. Our guru sahib were highest of all as they were poran tam avtar- poran parkash roop limited kaala, sarab kala samarath - satguru nanak dev ji.
Metaphysics of avtar is mentioned in both puratan text and gurmat text:
"Yada Yada Hi Dharmasya
Glanirva Bhavathi Bharatha,
Abhyuthanam Adharmaysya
Tadatmanam Srijami Aham'.
Praritranaya Sadhunam
Vinashaya Cha Dushkritam
Sambhavami Yuge-Yuge." Bhagvad gita
Bhagvad gita (Also see sant gyani gurbachan singh khalsa bhindranwale japji sahib steek page 34 where yada yada quote is quoted answering a question why krishan maharaj and sarab kala samarth satguru nanak dev ji had to come) http://www.gurmatveechar.com/literature?browse=Steeks_and_Teekas/Sant_Kartar_Singh_%28Bhindrawale%29
Sri Dasam Guru Granth sahib Maharaj:
Jab Jab Aristh Hoth Sansara Tab Tab Deh Dharat Avtara.
Here are pages from japji sahib teeka by sant gyani gurbachan singh bhindranwale talking about very definition of avtar and six types of sargun avtars immanentes from akaal purkh/maha vishnu according to akaal purkh hakum and needs.. See attachment by sant gyani gurbachan singh khalsa bhindranwale while maintaining satguru nanak dev nirankar were higher than all of these avtars, and limitless powers.... Krishan ji were sixteen kala avtar, has all sixteen characteristics first being bhramgyan/gyan rest follows.
3. Six types of avtars body above are made out shud satogun (maya), while our guru sahiban is pure parkash roop. Kaal in sri dasam guru granth sahib is shakti of akaal purkh, so ultimately all avtars were subjected to kaal as they were in terms of body (made out of shud satogun) just like everybody else ( panj tatwas will be destroyed- shalok nauvan) - guru maharaj set the record straight to rise people surti's/awareness* from sargun(mithiya maya) into nirgun-advait(realization of self) as people during that time were stuck in excessive sargun upasana and wrap their head around sargun avtars- made that into road block themselves in their spirituality.
However, this is no where to be seen as doubt to their avastha whereas it was vahiguroo all along in various different forms thats his khel". Yes previous avtars underestimated nirankar but this was akaal purkh maya khel himself (nothing is outside of hakum) and this to further his play at the end they were all merged back in nirankar...indeed they were sargun avtars of akaal purkh (small, medium, big according to need in yugas) where else they would merge to? ... we don't beleive in separate entity satan like christians do.
*Above- raising awareness also indicitates why sri guru gobind singh maharaj gave such strong cautionary tarna to us followers so we don't confine him into only sargun aspect as sri guru gobind singh ji saroop is not only sargun, all prevading pure consciouness/awareness.
jae ham ko paramaesar ouchar hai | thae sabh narak kundd mehi par hai |
Those who call me God, will fall into the pit of hell.
Not to mention repetitively mention of worship of one non dual all prevading nirgun jot in gurbani in aad guru granth sahib ji and sri dasam granth sahib ji via shabad and shabad gyan.
Gurbani both aad guru granth sahib, sri dasam guru granth sahib and ethashik granths like soraj parkash granth also talks about updesh to khalsa to realize his own self- akaal purkh nirgun roop, rise above from excessive sarguna upasana of any avtars for that matter (nit-sants, avnit-narsingh, karak, hari, karak, pooran, guru) and realize at the back of head that final updesh is for khalsa to only worships akaal purkh in form of shabad and its gyan- contemplatation of all prevading self-atma-paratma-advait ek jot akaal purkh and all these above avtars are all inside of us- our real param jot self ~ Sat chit anand svaroop ~
4. Ultimately khands in japji sahib are state of mind of being, according to gurbani and sant gyani gurbachan singh bhindranwale katha- sargun ram and krishna are also in karam khand (bakshish grace khand) equilavent to turiya avastha, these are not physical realms but they appear and disappear and appear disappear in one consciousness as one progresses in spirituality so they are not confined to christian version of khands as some sikhs like to beleive.
Real saroop of krishan ji is all gyan saroop all prevading lord saroop pure consciouness. He himself mentions in bhagvad gita to arjuna.
5. Ultimately from advait gurmat sidhant in akaal ustati and rest of gurbani its all one..krishnas and raam, from advait gurmat sidhant (ultimate stage) jot of krishan and raam and jot of ant or worm is one and same but until one does not reach that stage of non transcendental turiya tith avastha acknowledgement and respect should be given to all avtars as we would do to Sants... As we are still in our egoic mind, dualism as we are still in spiritual sikhi journey.
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Dear SevaSimran333,

Krishna, can never ever be the supreme god to be worshipped.

And I say this with a very heavy heart, because I can very well imagine, how much shocking could this be for you, and I am really sorry for it. I am going to try to talk to you very frankly and directly, just as I had wished, someone to explain me things, if I were in your place.

You see, it is not at all ine one´s hand to believe or know Him(Satpurukh) even.

In the Bani is very well stated, that He himself makes some wander, and to others, He makes them have faith in Him, and saves them according to a particular technique practiced by them alone.

And this is done, as brother N30S1NGH says above, because He wants His creation to go on. If it was like that easy, that whenever one listens to the True teachings, one would accept them, but the reality is quite different. That is why, there are so many religions, so may paths, so many philosophers, so many avatars, so many prophets....this is all for the purpose of deluding souls, so that they may never ever think even by mistake of Wahiguru Akal Purukh.

Then bear in mind also, that not all of us in sikhee, are walking straight, most of our brothers and sisters, have gone astray, as the main base teachings of our Guru Sahibans, are almost lost, and are thus entangled in outer forms of worships, of rules and regulations, like the rest of mazabs and dharams of the world, which is totally the contrary in sikhee.

The Bani clearly says: Dharam mazab ka jiskau abheemaan, seh andhaa moorakgh agyan .

Love for the teachings, is demonstrated by following them, and getting transformed from a manmukh to a gurmukh, from a ordinary person to a sikh, to a disciple of the Guru. This is the purpose of sikhee, of merging our souls in Wahiguru, everything else is paraphernalia

I am quite aware, that many of my brothers on reading this what I am saying, may get angry at me, and think that I am crazy.

But frankly speaking, I do not care for the world, for me the teachings of our Guru Sahibans are my very life. For if, ever I have to account anything, it is with Him alone.

Though I feel very sad and disheartened, when I see that, as I do often repeat, we have the best teachers, Our Guru Sahibans, who have left the best path for us, Gurmat, and yet we are running here and there, and have adulterated their Bani, with a political touch, with affairs of country, land and patriotism ....and so saddening, that we go to the extent of giving up lives or even taking lives, that also in the name of god, and we are then considered as heros.... all these things have distracted our attention and focus from Wahiguru, though each and everyone will say, are you mad? I have deep love and reverence for Wahiguru.

And all this is due to the manmukhs, who have driven us far away from sikhee, and made Gurmat as any other religion of the world, with its rules, regulations, do´s and donts. When the fact is, to love and merge in Wahiguru, only purity of mind and heart is needed.

Because this devotion is done by the soul, not by the body.

How does it affect, what is your color of skin, wheteher you are from east or west, north or south, if you are short, tall, rich or poor, or even how you dress..... you see all these things or aspects are related to the body, and the body is not our true self, thus the body is perishable...and then, so many wars, so many fights we do, so many attrocities and sins we commit, for just mistaking that we are this very body, and that all that we do and get, shall carry it with us to the next world

The thing is, we proffess love and devotion for Wahiguru, but, we do not do at all, what the Bani says. We just bow to Guru Maharaj, Sree Guru Granth Sahib, but what it says, almost nobody cares.

We think by bowing and respecting to the Guru, everything is achieved. Which is far from reality. Real achievements are got, as per practically putting into action, what it says, and paying attention to the message it gives us ...

The Bani says, Wahiguru is within you, and this your body is His living temple. Har mandir eheu sareer hae, gyan ratan pargat hoe.

But yet we go here and there for pilgrimages... and do not even sit to do His dhyan, or His bandagee, then too some argue, and say: why to sit like cranes, better get up and do some paath, or recite the Bani so many times .... you see this is maanmat, and everybody is copying and doing what he /she/we see others doing, it is like blind guiding blind.... when the fact is, He is within us for us only, all the 24 hours, then too we are misled

Instead to take the Bani as our guide, then there will be no mistakes ...but we like to see and read what we like, sometimes I have a feeling that the leaders, or the learned ones, do not want to let us know the truths of the Bani, they do not want us the ordinary people to use our brains in a clear manner, to the extent, that when we see something does not go according to what we think sikhee to be, we will not spare that person.

Sikhee, Gurmat, is a path of love and devotion to the only one Wahiguru Akal Purukh alone. It emphasizes only on the devotion to Wahiguru through His chintan, through His Simran.

That is why our Guru sahibans said: Sarab dharam meh srest dharam, Har ko nam jap nirmal karam.

The purpose of any True Guru, is to purify the soul from the dirt accumulated on it by the mind and karmas, and make it thus worthy to merge in Wahiguru, through His simran.

What does the word religion menas? This word comes from the latin word religare, which means, that which enables the union with the origin.

And so what is that, that enables our union with Him? Is it our rules, is it our regulations, is it doing what we like?

No, the answer according to the Bani, is our Nam Simran.

But for this practice we do not care, we take this like concepts, like theory...because we are so much under the belief that we are the body, that by sitting at one place and doing His Simran seva, we feel we are not doing anything with the body, so this could not be something valid.

So you see, even in our sikh community, many are misled, not that their goal is not perfect or correct , but the ways, and practices they do, divert them away from their goal, which is Wahiguru.

We do and are ready for everything, but Nam Simran....no, no, no. We need many more things to cling on, so to feel, that we are sikhs ...because that is what we have been seeing done for the past several hundreds years.

One thing, which differntiates our sikhee from other dharams, is that, we believe in only one supreme reality, namely Wahiguru.

But the hindus believe in many gods, devis, devtas,which have wives, children, who have weapons and use them ...like the trident, chakra, gadda, sitting on tigers, serpent around the neck, long hair, moon and river on the head... masculine, feminie, animals, devils... a huge variety of beings, dependending on their levels of consciousness....

Then also they have trinity. Ask the worshippers of Shiva, and they will say Shiva is bigger, so you see, among the hindus, even they do not agree whom to worship...but not only that, but they also are taught to worship the lesser gods, or the planets devtas, the sea god, and an endless list of these gods, and poojas, paaths, lamps, incense, flowers, fastings, pilgrimages, etc, etc and etc.

Krishna is an avatar of lord Vishnu, Krishna is not and individual identity by itself .... not even the only god, it is part of a trinity

On the contrary if any sikh is asked how many gods do you have? or believe in? All will surely say, only one Wahiguru Akal Purukh.

in the very beginning, the Bani says: Ik Oankar, means, He is one without any second or multiplicity. Satnam, He is the everlasting Truth.

Karta Purakh, He is the only doer without the help of anyone. Nirbahv Niravair, He is without any fear and enemity towards anyone. Akal Moorat, He is beyond time and death. Ajoonee, He is not born in any form . Saebhang, He is self sufficient. Gurparsad, He is realized by the grace of the teachings of Gurmat.

This Wahiguru is the highest being, He is above all gods and devis or devtas. He never, allows Himself to be worshipped in any inert or lifless objects or things, like those made of stone, paper, plastic or metal... but these gods and entities, they promote moortee poojas and willingly accept it as devotion ....

While,His devotion is the highest among all practices. His devotion brings purity of mind and heart. And His devotion is done for the sake of Himself alone. Unlike in other dharmas, when one does the devotion of any of their gods, even if you have their darshan, and if you are an ill minded soul, your impurities are not washed away.

You have the example of Ravan, he was the greatest devotee of Shiva, but then too, after so much tapasya, were his kam, krodh, lobh, moh or ahankar diminished or removed? Of course not. Not only that, but he commited many more sins.

Devotion to these gods, can not remove your impurities, you move according to the purity of your mind....

These avatars come to establish righteousness in the world, they perform miracles, and display their powers, they punish the sinners and reward the benevolents, their purpose is to get the souls stucked in the creation, and for this fact, even they are not aware of, as they are fulfilling a task assigned to them.

The followers and devotees of these gods, when they devote themselves to these deities, they may have their darshan and stay in Baikunth or Swarg for a limited period of time...but they never become one with that trinity ...each and every soul keeps intact it´s individual identity, until their stock of good karmas and bhakti is over, they return back into the creation, in the cycle of eighty four.

Whenever these gods appear to their devotees, they always say: I am satisfied with your devotion, ask whatever boon you want....

It is a way of keeping that soul confined into the web of the creation

On the contrary, in Gurmat, even stones are carried across the mahabhavsagar. Nanak, Nam jahaz hae.

With the devotion of Wahiguru, all of your impurities are washed away, your mind turns down, and has no more desires...then the only desire that the soul has, is to become one with Him, that´s it.

If even one is a sinner, by His grace, you are turned into a Saint, into a Gurmukh, and become as pure as He is, to the extent, that you merge in Him, and become one with Him, without any distinction. You are not a distinct identity anymore.

And the Bani says: Sach Khand vaseh Nirankar. It does not say, if you reach there, you will continue to be you.


One looses it´s identity of individuality long before, in the realms of mind and maya, and thus when it reaches there in Sach Khand, it becomes one with Nirankar Akal Purukh.

This is in essence sikhee.

Such is the greatness of Gurmat, and Wahiguru.

*P.S: please read the Bani with care and attention, you will be amazed and lost into a state of wonder, with the beauty and love and highest gyan, that it contains.

If you have any questions, you may ask any of the brothers on this website or any other sikh website, all of them are well prepared to gladly let you know, the inmensity of Wahiguru Akal Purukh and His Bani.

*Please forgive me, if you or anybody is hurt by this my post. My intentions are only to bring the awareness, of the praises of Wahiguru and His Bani, as this is only medicine for our souls, which are in a constant state of sorrow and pain.

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Thank you for your very sincere reply harsharan000, I very much appreciate the time you committed to explaining and clarifying the Sikh position.

~I would just like to simply reply with a few comments to help clear confusion about our beliefs here.

We are not hindu, although many would probably group us into that category because we worship God in his form of Krsna which is traditionally from hindu background. We are sometimes referenced to as being from the Vaisnava Vedanta Satsang.

We also do not believe in the trinity that you speak of. It is true that many hindus have the belief of God as Brahma Visnu Shiva, but we are not of that sect. Our belief is simply that Krishna is God in His original form and personality. It is basically saying that we believe God has an eternal form, and an eternal personality, that personality is Krishna.

I hope I don't get too confusing here...so I will try to explain (just as you did for me) as thoroughly as possible.

The trinity of Brahma Visnu and Shiva, we believe to be demi gods. They all hold posts in this material creation with certain delegated duties. Brahma for instance is believed to be the creator of the material world (Although empowered through God and His energy). Lord Shiva is the destroyer of the material world after the cycle has been completed. Visnu is a bit different... he is said to be an expansion of Lord Krsna, so he is on equal level with Krsna, although in this position as Visnu he is providing the task of Maintainer of the material creation while representing the mode of goodness.

We also believe there is only One God. This one God has many names however: Waheguru, Krishna, Narayana, Jehova, Jah, Rama etc.

Like Sikhs, we also believe that God dwells within the hearts of every living creature. We are all a part of God's energy.

The other principle difference from what you have described in Sikhism is that we believe one retains there personality when making their final journey to the spiritual world. This is in order to relate to the Supreme Person in a loving way. Just as admittedly the Soul does not perish when the body ceases, we believe that one's soul has a personality of sorts in its original spiritual position. This personality is based on the Soul's preference or desired way in which to express their love to The Lord. Our scriptures (Bhagavad Gita, and Srimad Bhagavatam), teach us that we retain our identity, although not the false ego of identifying with this material body.

It is said that the devotee of Krsna is only satisfied when he is able to offer devotional service to The Lord. For this reason, the devotee does not ask for anything material from The Lord, but only that he may never forget Him.

We also have been instructed that the best way to cleanse our past karma and to obtain pure love for God is the hearing and chanting of His Holy Names (Hare Nama). Since we believe Krishna is our Supreme Worshipable Lord we prefer to chant/sing His names (Rama, Krsna, Hari, Gopala, Govinda, Modana, Mohana) These names have a gradual cleansing effect (which I am sure you are well aware of), that can purify our hearts and minds. Our goal is only to love God as much as is possible, while serving Him in this material manifestation. Our practice is called Bhakti Yoga.

The soul's natural desire in life is to love. We want to love somebody or something, and in turn want to be loved equally as much. So, like you, we turn our love to God. This is the only real satisfaction and what can carry us back to Godhead.

My question to whomever may wish to answer is this: If one has lost their identity and merged back into Wahiguru, what does one do there? Or what happens to You? If you, as a Soul, has always existed, then what is it that the Soul does in this merged state?

Thank you for your time and consideration for my ignorance on these topics,


Seva Simran

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If I remember correctly from the Bhagvad Gita by A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami the soul does not lose it's individuality when it dwells with Krishna. On the other hand it has already been proven Gurmat rejects the very notion of Krishna being the supreme being himself! How does this concept of the soul, propounded by the Gita, relate with Gurmat?

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If I remember correctly from the Bhagvad Gita by A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami the soul does not lose it's individuality when it dwells with Krishna. On the other hand it has already been proven Gurmat rejects the very notion of Krishna being the supreme being himself! How does this concept of the soul, propounded by the Gita, relate with Gurmat?

Different interpretations but we also have to look at the context as there is bhagti, karam, yog and gyan marg within bhagvad gita, if that translation relates to bhagti then its talking about sargun bhagti/mukhti - it really depends on seeker as similiarly listed there - http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?/topic/73019-mukti/ but when it comes to discourses in gyan marg then krishna makes it absolutely clear to that arjuna explore his own real self- vedas/Upanishads esteroric gyan of self-OM turiya one all pervading consciousness..!!

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    • Today we have a major issue with Sikh youth walking into university classes like sociology and walking out extremist.  Whether that be feminist extremist or LGBTQ extremist or atheist.  When it comes to Gurbani these groups and people look for lines or a line of Gurbani and take it out of context to support their extremist LGBTQ beliefs on marriage,  gender being same or new thing no gender or infinite gender.  Like we had the ignorant couple from the states who got married by having his wife walk along with him.  The point being they dont follow Guru Sahib.   They attain 'knowledge' else where and want to force it on Sikhi.   The Sikh youth laugh at the Sikhs who bow at a fake baba's feet.  But, the irony is the Gurmukhs are shaking their head at both of them.  One is bowing to a fake baba and the other is bowing their mind by accepting secular knowledge that will always be in the trial phase.  Neither are better than the other.  The youth of today, and it's been done by a few old farts, attain masters or doctorate in fields like chemistry,  sociology or another field and then say we have a doctorate in Sikhi.  They write articles on what they want Sikhi to be and in their name they put "dr.".  Such deception is being done by these old farts.  Sikhi is about honesty, yet they start their article with deception.    If you want to be a Sikh, then Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji is the teacher and classroom.  Not your sociology professor who tells you abortion of a 37 week baby is a women birth right choice, but dont kill that cow because imeat industry  is killing the environment,  go vegan.   In short,  dont be the monkey with the wrench. 
    • When it comes to other religious scriptures why did Guru Sahib say to read them? Was it to understand how to be moral? Gurbani provides us with spiritual wisdom and morals of the highest kind. It would be counterproductive to look else where for morals. Guru sahib says, give me your head (completely and only focus on the shabad) when you come on the Gurmat path. Guru Sahib tells sikhs to read other religious scriptures because when a Gurmukh has fully attuned his mind with Gurbani he can see naam everywhere. So when reading other religious scripture the Gurmukh can pick up on the naam that is there and serve the humans that are lost in the vedas, gita, bible, Koran, Torah, etc. Also Gurbani makes references on other religious scriptures concepts so we can achieve a total picture of their concepts when reading their scriptures. But many lose sight of the goal and start collecting merchandise (intellectual knowledge and maya)from these scriptures. But Guru Sahib says all merchandise can be achieved from Gurbani. Anand Sahib says this path is sharper than a double edged sword and finer than a hair.  The path of Gurmat can be simple if we follow the instructions of Gurbani or life can be made difficult by losing the purpose in life as Gurbani describes it.
    • I try to read it once a year. There's a lot to be learned from a human perspective in terms of the morals and the arguments it raises. A person doesn't have to be a Hindophile to glean something meaningful from the text.
    • U r right brother, Raam failed.Infact Gurbani says Vishnu and his avatars r subject to jamm/ kaal.
    • Iv never read mahabharat, iv got it on kindle.  It definitely sounds more interesting.  
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