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Is Krishna The Most Supreme God Worshipped In Guru Granth Sahib Also ?


Guest SarabjeetSingh
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Bhai Sahib, have you read Chaubis Avtaar by Guru Gobind Singh Ji?

It will clear all your misconceptions.

Sadly not, brother. Is there anywhere I can read it in English? I know English doesn't cover all nuances of Gurmukhi, but its better than not understanding anything.

EDIT: Sorry, I misread the post. I thought you were asking me. :BL:

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Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa

Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

Saadh Sangat Jee,

Gurbani quotes should not be taken out of context, it is very important to read the Bhagat Bani in context and not quote passages here and there to try and prove your point. Throughout Gurbani it is explictly stated that we worship none other than Waheguru.

Taking the following quote posted by SarabjeetSingh Jee -

"O my Father, Lord of wealth, blessed are You, long-haired, dark-skinned, my darling. ||1||Pause||

You hold the steel chakra in Your hand; You came down from Heaven, and saved the life of the elephant.

In the court of Duhsaasan, You saved the honor of Dropati, when her clothes were being removed. ||1||

You saved Ahliyaa, the wife of Gautam; how many have You purified and carried across?

Such a lowly outcaste as Naam Dayv has come seeking Your Sanctuary. ||2||2||"

(SGGS, p988)

[ please note that Anthropomorphic notions have been used throughout Gurbani to comprehend God. ]

If you read further Bhagat Nam Dev Jee states -

"Within all hearts, the Lord speaks, the Lord speaks. Who else speaks, other than the Lord? 1 . Pause .

Out of the same clay, the elephant, the ant, and the many sorts of species are formed.

In stationary life forms, moving beings, worms, moths and within each and every heart, the Lord is contained. . 1 .

Remember the One, Infinite Lord; abandon all other hopes.

Naam Dayv prays, I have become dispassionate and detached; who is the Lord and Master, and who is the slave? 2 .3 "

(SGGS, p988)

So I ask SarabjeetSingh what does he understand when he reads the full passage in context? The last passage explains Bhagat Nam Dev Jee's position.

Please also take into account the following quote from Bhagat Nam Dev Jee -

In the one and in the many, He is pervading and permeating; wherever I look, there He is.

The marvelous image of Maya is so fascinating; how few understand this. ||1||

God is everything, God is everything. Without God, there is nothing at all.

As one thread holds hundreds and thousands of beads, He is woven into His creation. ||1||Pause||

The waves of the water, the foam and bubbles, are not distinct from the water.

This manifested world is the playful game of the Supreme Lord God; reflecting upon it, we find that it is not different from Him. ||2||

False doubts and dream objects - man believes them to be true.

The Guru has instructed me to try to do good deeds, and my awakened mind has accepted this. ||3||

Says Naam Dayv, see the Creation of the Lord, and reflect upon it in your heart.

In each and every heart, and deep within the very nucleus of all, is the One Lord. ||4||1||

(SGGS, p485)

Here is the full second quote from SarabjeetSingh -

The Supreme Lord God is imperishable, the Transcendent Lord, the Inner-knower, the Searcher of hearts. He is the Slayer of demons, our Supreme Lord and Master.

The Supreme Rishi, the Master of the sensory organs, the uplifter of mountains, the joyful Lord playing His enticing

flute. 1 .

The Enticer of Hearts, the Lord of wealth, Krishna, the Enemy of ego. The Lord of the Universe, the Dear Lord, the Destroyer of demons.

The Life of the World, our eternal and ever-stable Lord and Master dwells within each and every heart, and is always with us. 2 .

The Support of the Earth, the man-lion, the Supreme Lord God. The Protector who tears apart demons with His teeth, the Upholder of the earth. O Creator, You assumed the form of the pygmy to humble the demons; You are the Lord God of all. 3.

You are the Great Raam Chand, who has no form or feature. Adorned with flowers, holding the chakra in Your hand, Your form is incomparably beautiful. You have thousands of eyes, and thousands of forms. You alone

are the Giver, and all are beggars of You. 4.

You are the Lover of Your devotees, the Master of the masterless. The Lord and Master of the milk-maids, You are the companion of all. O Lord, Immacuate Great Giver, I cannot describe even an iota of Your Glorious Virtues. 5 .

Liberator, Enticing Lord, Lord of Lakshmi, Supreme Lord God. Savior of Dropadi's honor. Lord of Maya, miracle-worker, absorbed in delightful play, unattached. 6 .

The Blessed Vision of His Darshan is fruitful and rewarding; He is not born, He is self-existent. His form is undying; it is never destroyed. O imperishable, eternal, unfathomable Lord, everything is attached to You. 7 .

The Lover of greatness, who dwells in heaven. By the Pleasure of His Will, He took incarnation as the great fish and the tortoise. The Lord of beauteous hair, the Worker of miraculous deeds, whatever He wishes, comes to pass. 8 .

He is beyond need of any sustenance, free of hate and all-pervading. He has staged His play; He is called the four-armed Lord. He assumed the beautiful form of the blue-skinned Krishna; hearing His flute, all are fascinated and enticed. 9.

He is adorned with garlands of flowers, with lotus eyes. His ear-rings, crown and flute are so beautiful. He carries the conch, the chakra and the war club; He is the Great Charioteer, who stays with His Saints. 10 .

The Lord of yellow robes, the Master of the three worlds. The Lord of the Universe, the Lord of the world; with my mouth, I chant His Name. The Archer who draws the bow, the Beloved Lord God; I cannot count all His limbs. 11 .

He is said to be free of anguish, and absolutely immaculate. The Lord of prosperity, pervading the water, the land and the sky. He is near this world and the nether regions of the underworld; His Place is permanent, ever-stable and imperishable. 12 .

The Purifier of sinners, the Destroyer of pain and fear. The Eliminator of egotism, the Eradicator of coming and going. He is pleased with devotional worship, and merciful to the meek; He cannot be appeased by any other qualities. 13 .

The Formless Lord is undeceivable and unchanging. He is the Embodiment of Light; through Him, the whole world blossoms forth. He alone unites with Him, whom He unites with Himself. No one can attain the Lord by himself. 14.

He Himself is the milk-maid, and He Himself is Krishna. He Himself grazes the cows in the forest. You Yourself create, and You Yourself destroy. Not even a particle of filth attaches to You. 15 .

Which of Your Glorious Virtues can I chant with my one tongue? Even the thousand-headed serpent does not know Your limit. One may chant new names for You day and night, but even so, O God, no one can describe even one of Your Glorious Virtues. 16 .

I have grasped the Support, and entered the Sanctuary of the Lord, the Father of the world. The Messenger of Death is terrifying and horrendous, and sea of Maya is impassable. Please be merciful, Lord, and save me, if it is Your Will; please lead me to join with the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy. 17 .

All that is seen is an illusion. I beg for this one gift, for the dust of the feet of the Saints, O Lord of the Universe. Applying it to my forehead, I obtain the supreme status; he alone obtains it, unto whom You give it. 18 .

Those, unto whom the Lord, the Giver of peace, grants His Mercy, grasp the feet of the Holy, and weave them into their hearts. They obtain all the wealth of the Naam, the Name of the Lord; the unstruck sound current of His Word vibrates and resounds within their minds. 19 .

With my tongue I chant the Names given to You. 'Sat Naam' is Your perfect, primal Name. Says Nanak, Your devotees have entered Your Sanctuary. Please bestow the Blessed Vision of Your Darshan; their minds are filled with love for You. 20

You alone know Your state and extent. You Yourself speak, and You Yourself describe it. Please make Nanak the slave of Your slaves, O Lord; as it pleases Your Will, please keep him with Your slaves. 21 . 2 . 11.

Once again could SarabjeetSingh enlighten us to what he understands when he reads the full passage in context?

In the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee, the names of Hindu gods and goddesses have been attributed to God in His praise. Whatever excellence is in any one, it is actually, the Excellence of the Creator Lord abiding in all. Be it clearly

understood in all creatures, good, evil, super good, He alone abides, and is the Doer, none else. All attributes of any one are actually the attributes of Infinite Unfathomable Lord Himself, none else. Without God we are nothing.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa

Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

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Guest SarabjeetSingh

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa

Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

Saadh Sangat Jee,

Gurbani quotes should not be taken out of context, it is very important to read the Bhagat Bani in context and not quote passages here and there to try and prove your point. Throughout Gurbani it is explictly stated that we worship none other than Waheguru.

Taking the following quote posted by SarabjeetSingh Jee -

[ please note that Anthropomorphic notions have been used throughout Gurbani to comprehend God. ]

If you read further Bhagat Nam Dev Jee states -

So I ask SarabjeetSingh what does he understand when he reads the full passage in context? The last passage explains Bhagat Nam Dev Jee's position.

Please also take into account the following quote from Bhagat Nam Dev Jee -

Here is the full second quote from SarabjeetSingh -

Once again could SarabjeetSingh enlighten us to what he understands when he reads the full passage in context?

In the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee, the names of Hindu gods and goddesses have been attributed to God in His praise. Whatever excellence is in any one, it is actually, the Excellence of the Creator Lord abiding in all. Be it clearly

understood in all creatures, good, evil, super good, He alone abides, and is the Doer, none else. All attributes of any one are actually the attributes of Infinite Unfathomable Lord Himself, none else. Without God we are nothing.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa

Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

THANKS for your contribution !

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  • 3 years later...

I agree with the points made by my learned brothers and sisters who say we have not been told to worship Krishna.

Has anyone read Mahabharata? I mean the full text? Before the battle against the Kauravas when Arjun loses his nerve and doesn't want to fight, Krishna has a one-to-one conversation with him which - if I remember correctly - is what is known today as the Bhagwad Gita. Has anyone seen the manner in which Krishna refers to himself in those verses? Its as if he believes he himself is the Creator - not just someone sent by God. Its very.....I don't know in-case I say something disrespectful but it comes across as if Krishna is saying "I am God".

Does anyone with greater knowledge on the subject know why he would speak in such a manner?

Lord Sri Krishna is saying all of this to Arjuna because He is The Supreme Lord, The Cause of All Causes. This may be difficult to grasp at first, but He says this to Arjuna many times in Bhagavad Gita. He is not 'channeling God', but He is in fact God Himself. Is it not restricting to say that God cannot expand Himself into material creation without being affected by it? God can appear anywhere, and anytime that He pleases, to say otherwise is to say we know more than God or that we can grasp who He really is in totality.

It appears from reading what Guru Nanak has written about Lord Sri Krishna, that he is a dear lover of God. It is no coincidence that Guru Nanak appeared on Earth during the same time period as Lord Chaitanya (the incarnation of Krishna in the form of a pure lover of God). There are stories of their meetings as well. Both Lord Chaitanya and Guru Nanak traveled singing praises of God, chanting His Holy Names and describing His endless glories.

God is unlimited and inconceivable. He has form and this form is eternally Sat Chit Ananda. The quoted lines in the first post of this thread and Bhagavad Gita along with Srimad Bhagavtam are completely in line with one another. Guru Nanak is praising Krishna and His pastimes. This is the art and science of Bhakti Yoga, coming to love God completely. One may simply chant the Maha Mantra to come to a closer relationship with God 'Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare'. God has many names and these are just a few of them, which are ancient and cary the full potency of God Himself. These names are transcendental, and can deliver one from this material world to the spiritual world of never-ending love for God.

God Bless~ Haribol! (Chant the names of God)

Seva

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I was not going to say so , but after going through these , what is to say that Krishna isn't Akal Purakh Waheguru himself ?

O my Father, Lord of wealth, blessed are You, long-haired, dark-skinned, my darling. ||1||Pause||

ਕਰ ਧਰੇ ਚਕ੍ਰ ਬੈਕੁੰਠ ਤੇ ਆਏ ਗਜ ਹਸਤੀ ਕੇ ਪ੍ਰਾਨ ਉਧਾਰੀਅਲੇ ॥

You hold the steel chakra in Your hand; You came down from Heaven, and saved the life of the elephant.

ਦੁਹਸਾਸਨ ਕੀ ਸਭਾ ਦ੍ਰੋਪਤੀ ਅੰਬਰ ਲੇਤ ਉਬਾਰੀਅਲੇ ॥੧॥

In the court of Duhsaasan, You saved the honor of Dropati, when her clothes were being removed. ||1||

ਗੋਤਮ ਨਾਰਿ ਅਹਲਿਆ ਤਾਰੀ ਪਾਵਨ ਕੇਤਕ ਤਾਰੀਅਲੇ ॥

You saved Ahliyaa, the wife of Gautam; how many have You purified and carried across?

ਐਸਾ ਅਧਮੁ ਅਜਾਤਿ ਨਾਮਦੇਉ ਤਉ ਸਰਨਾਗਤਿ ਆਈਅਲੇ ॥੨॥੨॥

Such a lowly outcaste as Naam Dayv has come seeking Your Sanctuary. ||2||2||

(SGGS : 988)

Pondering over above shabad , wasn't it Krishna who saved honor of draupadi ? Also , God is formless , Chakra is related to Krishna .

ਨਿਰਾਹਾਰੀ ਨਿਰਵੈਰੁ ਸਮਾਇਆ ॥

He is beyond need of any sustenance, free of hate and all-pervading.

ਧਾਰਿ ਖੇਲੁ ਚਤੁਰਭੁਜੁ ਕਹਾਇਆ ॥

He has staged His play; He is called the four-armed Lord.

ਸਾਵਲ ਸੁੰਦਰ ਰੂਪ ਬਣਾਵਹਿ ਬੇਣੁ ਸੁਨਤ ਸਭ ਮੋਹੈਗਾ ॥੯॥

He assumed the beautiful form of the blue-skinned Krishna; hearing His flute, all are fascinated and enticed. ||9||

ਬਨਮਾਲਾ ਬਿਭੂਖਨ ਕਮਲ ਨੈਨ ॥

He is adorned with garlands of flowers, with lotus eyes.

ਸੁੰਦਰ ਕੁੰਡਲ ਮੁਕਟ ਬੈਨ ॥

His ear-rings, crown and flute are so beautiful.

ਸੰਖ ਚਕ੍ਰ ਗਦਾ ਹੈ ਧਾਰੀ ਮਹਾ ਸਾਰਥੀ ਸਤਸੰਗਾ ॥੧੦॥

He carries the conch, the chakra and the war club; He is the Great Charioteer, who stays with His Saints. ||10||

ਪੀਤ ਪੀਤੰਬਰ ਤ੍ਰਿਭਵਣ ਧਣੀ ॥

The Lord of yellow robes, the Master of the three worlds.

ਜਗੰਨਾਥੁ ਗੋਪਾਲੁ ਮੁਖਿ ਭਣੀ ॥

The Lord of the Universe, the Lord of the world; with my mouth, I chant His Name.

ਸਾਰਿੰਗਧਰ ਭਗਵਾਨ ਬੀਠੁਲਾ ਮੈ ਗਣਤ ਨ ਆਵੈ ਸਰਬੰਗਾ ॥੧੧॥

The Archer who draws the bow, the Beloved Lord God; I cannot count all His limbs. ||11||

( SGGS : 1082)

The above shabad also sounds similar to description of Krishna . Actually , a RSS Sikh hater used same shabad against me to prove that Sikhism also worships Krishna .

ਸੰਖ ਚਕ੍ਰ ਮਾਲਾ ਤਿਲਕੁ ਬਿਰਾਜਿਤ ਦੇਖਿ ਪ੍ਰਤਾਪੁ ਜਮੁ ਡਰਿਓ ॥

He is adorned with the conch, the chakra, the mala and the ceremonial tilak mark on his forehead; gazing upon his radiant glory, the Messenger of Death is scared away.

(SGGS : 1105)

CAN SOME SIKHS PUT SOME LIGHT ON THIS TOPIC ?

The Bhagats were removed from the superficial bickerings of the RSS and other imbeciles. Bhagat Namdev expands upon Krishna's physical form whilst crediting the supreme Akal, who powers him as the true Krishna. The physical Krishna is only a hollow entity. His individuality is nothing but a figment of this illusory creation. The one who created him also created us. Subsequently that being also powers us and resides in us. If he could grant Krishna so much power, than imagine what he could do to us?

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here is the answer look at this website and read it it tells u

http://khojee.wordpress.com/2012/10/13/how-is-guru-nanak-dev-ji-different-from-previous-avtars/

One should express great caution when attempting to compare Lord Krishna with Guru Nanak. Especially when one is making the claim that Guru Nanak is greater than Lord Krishna due to Krishna's pastimes on this Earth that one does not fully understand. It is a grave spiritual mistake to attempt to make Guru Nanak seem great by saying how Lord Krishna was not as great, or by saying that he was 'unable to eradicate cardinal sin'. The comment of how Guru Nanak is greater than Krishna because 'he grew a beard' is borderline ridiculous...I mean really? this isn't a beard growing competition here folks. There is no doubt of Guru Nanak's greatness, and the fact that Nanak is praising Sri Krishna, singing Him to be 'Lord of The Universe' and 'Master of the Three Worlds' should perhaps be a clue of Krishna's true position.

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