I am a Sikh

[Guest]

If we want to change the 3ho and make them stop doing mistakes then we have to be involved with them.We have to go to their gurduwaras and help them out.We can't just sit at the computer all day talking about their wrongs.If you want to make a difference then please mingle with them.They need some out side help.They need our acceptance.If we teach them they will learn.

[N30S1NGH]

The problem is with us, we assume too much. Ever heard of- due process? seeking clarification from accused directly?..the fact that no one attempted to seek clarification from accused is totally mind blogging and scary not to say atleast also pretty anti gurmat to begin with....it goes out to set an precedence that any tom self righteous cactus jacks can get up- make a flimsy, bleakly case against anyone who they don't agree with instead of finding out their state of mind, their angle approach...they can demonize, vilify crucify the hell out of them on khanda and our gullible sangat will blindly follow- burn that witch attitude, shoot the messenger- before asking questions than follow their own research...!!!

Problem with our community is we are pretty quick to put others be it snatam kaur or any parcharik/messenger for that matter on pedestal but we are even quicker to knock them down if they don't follow our own set of expectations, our way....!!!

Give me one example from history of sikh sant gurmukhs, bhai sahib, nihang jathedars,jathedar of takth sahibans engaging in this type of "witch haunt" like we are doing...!!!

[Raaj.Karega.Khalsa]

The problem is with us, we assume too much. Ever heard of- due process? seeking clarification from accused directly?..the fact that no one attempted to seek clarification from accused is totally mind blogging and scary not to say atleast also pretty anti gurmat to begin with....it goes out to set an precedence that any tom self righteous cactus jacks can get up- make a flimsy, bleakly case against anyone who they don't agree with instead of finding out their state of mind, their angle approach...they can demonize, vilify crucify the hell out of them on khanda and our gullible sangat will blindly follow- burn that witch attitude, shoot the messenger- before asking questions than follow their own research...!!!

Problem with our community is we are pretty quick to put others be it snatam kaur or any parcharik/messenger for that matter on pedestal but we are even quicker to knock them down if they don't follow our own set of expectations, our way....!!!

Give me one example from history of sikh sant gurmukhs, bhai sahib, nihang jathedars,jathedar of takth sahibans engaging in this type of "witch haunt" like we are doing...!!!

Dear Bhaji,

I agree that none of us have asked Bibi Snatam Kaur herself about these issues and are discussing (definitely the wrong word here) about her. But its all been going on for so long...has no one really ever asked them about the Hindu pujas etc.? (apart from Gursant Singh's public articles and videos)

I really haven't seen one single public explanation from their side that explains their worshipping to Hindu deities and uttering Hindu mantras.

Although, I agree to the phrase "witch hunt" you've mentioned above...but I really think that these issues do need to be addressed.

Also, in the other thread http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?/topic/70109-the-kundalini-yoga-crew-do-it-again-dancing-to-bani/?hl=%2B3ho+%2Bdancing the person who was trying to clarify their part of the perspective said it clearly that they do not promote it as Sikhi. It really does make me wonder why they still do it then?

If every single act of their lives revolves around Yoga and not around Sikhi, shouldn't they call themselves yogis rather than Sikhs?

Bhaji, surely you do not approve of the wedding video with no Anand Kaaraj shown..do you?

I mean, even if we did ask them about it, what kind of excuse can one still come up with? Maharaaj ji's saroop wasn't available? No Gurdwara around?

What's wrong with Anand Kaaraj?

(Also, don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to paint them all with the same brush. I admit I have seen other photos of some other 3HO couples sitting in Guru ji's hajoori for Anand Kaaraj.)

About questioning Parchaaraks.

I believe we, as sangat, have a right to question the rehni-behni of someone who comes up the stage to do parchaar of Sikhi, but isn't following it correctly themselves.

Be it Hazoori Ragis or Bibi Snatam Kaur or even a Singh Saheb.

[VanHelsingh]

N30Singh Ji - With all due respect (and I really mean that) maybe you're too close to this particular issue and those involved to be entirely objective?

[Mehtab Singh]

You know a while ago I posted a video about 3H0 where they were dancing to Gurbani being sung. I posted it on another forum also. There was one particular Rehitvaan Gurmukh pyaara who I expected to condemn it sternly. But his response actually shocked me. He said "There is a thirst for spirituality throughout the world. Before coming to Tatt Gurmat realm of spirituality, the Jeev, many times, has to go through different stages. As long as this dancing and Westernized Rock music kind of spiritual singing is not done at Gurdwara Sahib in the hazoori of Siri Guru Granth Sahib jee, I guess there is no harm in this. The ones who hear Gurbani and are moved by it, will someday be blessed with Tatt Gurmat. Even the ones who eat Degh of Gurughar definitely get Sikhi at some point in the future." These words came as a tight slap on my brain's narrow minded spectrum, and from then on I try to see things from his (i.e. a much broader) perspective.

Being a kattarvaadi doesn't imply that one is a Gurmukh. The only thing it implies is that the person still has a really long way to go. Doesn't mean we become like sheep and let anyone walk over us, but at the same time, you got to realize that Khalsa is Guru Sahib's garden, where there are several kinds of flower-roopi Jathebandis/Sampardas blooming. All have their own shapes, sizes, colors and fragrances, and that is what adds to the collective beauty of the garden-roopi Panth. The maryada of Sri Akal Takhat Sahib is the gardener and weeds out unwanted weeds, while the flowers are maintained.

Remember what Julius said in Remember The Titans? "None of us are perfect, none of us ever gonna be perfect, but this team...this TEAM is perfect". So Khalsa jee, its the collective perfection of us all that makes our Panth...PERFECT!!

[N30S1NGH]

About questioning Parchaaraks.

I believe we, as sangat, have a right to question the rehni-behni of someone who comes up the stage to do parchaar of Sikhi, but isn't following it correctly themselves.

Be it Hazoori Ragis or Bibi Snatam Kaur or even a Singh Saheb.

Thats fair enough penji but it has to be done via proper channels, our proper channel is through sri akaal takth sahib/our panj takth sahib..the dangers of "taking matter on our own hands" is within sangat there are all different sorts of people some don't believe in due process, some don't believe in understanding person accused state of mind/different perception- different approach, some is totally right or some is totally left..some want to totally bury the issue- cover up, some totally want to exaggerate, over blow the issue, some have ulterior motives, some hide behind authority, totalitarian rule to control and abuse power, some want to hijack the issue at hand, some want to divide and rule so thats why we cannot get anywhere..nothing is going to change than more bitterness, hostility, division as we are not following proper channels or following the sarbat khalsa way.

There are 130,000 3ho sikhs out there, thats a huge following of sikh dharam by non sikhs, each out of 130,000 have a story to tell how ultimately guru maharaj, gurbani beautifully introduced sikhi to them... each one of them have spike in them they are following sikh dharam as best as they could...we should leave them alone as long as certain protocols are followed that should be re-iterated by sri akaal takth sahib only not by me or you or sangat..akaal takth sahib is our voice..lets practice what we preach about standing under banner of sri akaal takth sahib...lets sri akaal takth sahib handle issues...in the meantime consider 3ho same as hindu consider - hare rama hare krishna movement in viriginia, give them some space, some learning expereince..even the most fascist hindu right wing rss consider hare rame hare krishna as hindus instead of demonizing, villify them and throwing them out..even one can learn from other dharams in general and their right wing fascist organizations....!!!

[N30S1NGH]

Here is sri akaal takth sahib jathedar warning against sikh extermism/katarvaad:

[Raaj.Karega.Khalsa]

edited: misunderstanding.

[N30S1NGH]

I was comparing how mainstream and even most fascist right wing Hindu organisation such as RSS consider Hare rama Hare Krishna movement in Virginia as hindus.. that may be we should look at that consider 3ho as sikhs.. follow their model of keeping unity.

[gurdeepsinghjohal]

RSS, uses religion to control power and they consider sikhs as hindu also. Leave them. Snatam Kaur is well aware what she is doing she is doing repetitively. Please Admin write them letter from all the Sikh Sangat requesting them to see if their practise is according to gurmat or not.