The origin of 5 Kakaars

[gurdeepsinghjohal]

Please enlighten people with close mind who are incharge in Akal Takht Sahib for printing of Guru Granth Sahib Beed to use Ang insteat of Panna.

[DSGj]

Please enlighten people with close mind who are incharge in Akal Takht Sahib for printing of Guru Granth Sahib Beed to use Ang insteat of Panna.

Where did I write anything against using the word "Panna" or "Page" ?

You're the one purposefully going against the word "Ang" because that's exactly the same as missionary/kala-afghana mentality.

You guys become so kintu-printu and tarksheel...that you have no problem trying to unnecessarily "de-mystify" any word you can find...when in reality, those words can mean many other things than what you are thinking with your closed mind.

[gurdeepsinghjohal]

Where did I write anything against using the word "Panna" or "Page" ?

You're the one purposefully going against the word "Ang" because that's exactly the same as missionary/kala-afghana mentality.

You guys become so kintu-printu and tarksheel...that you have no problem trying to unnecessarily "de-mystify" any word you can find...when in reality, those words can mean many other things than what you are thinking with your closed mind.

I use word page that is simple no question of kintu prantu GuptUnknow said u should use Ang because Guru Granth Sahib is Living Guru and simple assumption and understanding is Ang means body part, you posted the meaning of Ang also refers to it. Because of prem ras or bhagti ras you use Ang(Friend) use it who is stopping you.

[gurdeepsinghjohal]

This is wrong.Our guru has limbs.Each ang is the limb of the guru...Why make guru Granth sahib as a book?Books such as harry potter have pages but the true guru has angs...

Index of Guru Granth Sahib simply says Panna. Check it out :biggrin2:

But it also has message.

Its like

1. Jap(do the jaap:-Gurbani,simran,his name by speech, thought and mind. Akal purakh should be in your heart all the time)

2. So Dar(by doing jap you will be at the doors of God's house).

3. So Purakh( At his door you will meet him)

4. Sohella (your life will be filled with happiness)

[DSGj]

Thanks!

[Jonny101]

Please provide some shabad from Gurbani that enforces and justifies the existence of a place called hell where you will be damned.

Kindly point to exactly where the WHOLE shabad points this way and NOT just a single one-liner tuk which is usually misleading.

Please also provide your own interpretation where Guruji assures us the existence of Nark and where it is temporaryas you claim.

THEN- If the only thing eternal is GOD consciousness and all the rest of creation is Maya-illusion, then what exactly is Nark ???

Is it part of the Illusion or is it permanent like God-consciousness ??

If so, then that means Satan and Ravan all exist as being as powerful as the lord ???

I would suggest you read the following book by Surinder Singh Kohli on the traditional Sikh view of Death and after, It's the first book on the list.

http://www.gurmatveechar.com/literature?browse=English_Books/Surinder_Singh_Kohli

Also Andhiti Dunya by Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh Jee is also a good book on this subject.

[luckysingh99]

I would suggest you read the following book by Surinder Singh Kohli on the traditional Sikh view of Death and after, It's the first book on the list.

http://www.gurmatveechar.com/literature?browse=English_Books/Surinder_Singh_Kohli

Also Andhiti Dunya by Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh Jee is also a good book on this subject.

Thanks for that, I shall give it a good read.

Although, I skimmed through it and it does mention only the hindu mythological reference of suffering in a hell before births and this refers to several births.

However, I find that the author is a little conradicting because earlier he mentions that the hell for a sikh is the actual transmigration and 84 lak joons !

Therefore, I am still not convinced here !

Then there is the semi interesting little section of near death which doesn't tell you anything at all, so I was a little dissapointed here.

Anyway, I have my own interpretation and understanding of near death.

I can see why your approach to this matter was from the angle you were coming from.

Thanks for the references and I look forward to looking into them in detail, but you must remember that these are just additional readings and are NOT gurbani.

They are personal intepretations by the authors, and from th little I read I can confirm that he is making assumptions which in all fairness is fine, since he has explaned the reasons to his assumptions as well.

But we should NOT make the mistake of assuming it is FACT- for a sikh ONLY GURBANI is fact !

Therefore, I am not being critical about your approach at all, since you are referring to a wiser person's assumptions and in all honesty the world would be a better place if everyone did pay some attention to the wise !!

But I find it easier sometimes, especially in these situations that others seem to complicate and cause some confusion to actually-

- Just take a few steps back and think about Guru Nanak Philosophy.

- Guru Nanak ji, tried very hard to keep gurmat simple and straightforward.

-He tried to explain that it wasn't that complicated and we should try and make the most of where we are now and become gurmukh.

- He did mention that only fools like us argue about what happens after death or what happens if I do this and that.

- OUR FOCUS should be on attaining gurmukh/mukhti and not on what suffering do I get for bad deeds.....etc...etc..

If you keep this attitude, then you will realise just how trivial hell or narak is to a Sikh !!

Nevertheless, it is good discussion but there is no point debating over it.

Waheguru and God bless.

[gurdeepsinghjohal]

Waheguru and God bless.

I never knew Waheguru and God were different. :biggrin2:

Just Kidding.

This is serious you have very good approach. Very good explaination. :respect:

[chatanga]

Guru ji may have been impressed with the copy of hanuman natak that was given to him by Bahadur Shahm but he didn't translate it into gurmat.

The Granth was presented to 6th Guru, at Gwalior. Bahadur Shah wouoldnt have even been aware of its existence.

But coming back to the topic, we can say that the kakkars were in existence, but for the Sikhs, only Guru Ji gave their order to maintain them.

Why are Sikhs worried if Hanuman wore a kashera? Makes no difference to me whether he did or not.

[gurdeepsinghjohal]

If I am not wrong Sikhism is only religion which by every mean treat men and women equal.

Five K's equal for Singh and Singhni.