Hindus Wearing The Kara

[Singhni MiriPiri]

Hmm okay, but there are some Sikh phaats that I have seen that say certain castes gain certain 'stuff' from it. What do you think of that?

Please tell me, what are these certain stuff lol. We have no spiritual association to castes. It's primitive.

[Singhni MiriPiri]

lol okay. It's in this Brahm Kavach I found:

http://sikh-reality.blogspot.ca/2009/11/braham-kavich-translation.html

For example:

ਲਹਿਬੇਦਭੇਦਜੋਪਢੈਬਿਪ੍ਰਬੈਸਯਧੰਨਸੁਖਸੰਪਤਾ ॥

A Brahmin who reads this will know the secret of the Vedas, and a Vaish who reads with will attain comfort of wealth and family.

See, they get different 'stuff' while practicing this prayer. Hopefully you have taken your morning ishnaan before you read this

These are hindu castes, how are they associated with sikhs? Gurbani describes to us what a true brahmin and vaishnaav is, and has also made it clear that caste has no importance in our afterlife because a Gurmukh moves above all this.

[Kira]

The caste system isn't the problem, feeling superior to someone else because of your caste or being rude to someone because of caste is bad. Caste is what helps us from not becoming inbred people, and I am okay with marrying another caste but they must be a Gursikh So whats the problem now? I am not exclusive to just that river, I think going to any tirith is good but only if you actually pray, just going there and taking ishnaan while not praying etc won't be helpful. Do you understand what I am saying? Many people have said there is no point to go to the tirith if you don't pray on ParBrahman.

Sorry but lol. Firstly marrying into the respective Caste will actually RESTRICT the Gene pool and ENCOURAGE inbreeding and the promotion of double recessive genes which leads to genetic deficiencies.

I've yet to hear of a Mahapurkh that decides to go take a dip in the Ganges or any other River when Gurbani points out it's pointless. But as usual your perfect.

Also to counter your love to associate with the caste system Guru Sahib writes.

Now this is the part where you say Gurbani is wrong and you're 100% correct.

You said it yourself as Ekonankar In our religion you say it as Ik Oankar, but that doesn't mean it didn't exist in a philosophy in other religions before (not like this). They also know of ParBrahman and ParamAtma, whic is not a new thought. Lol it only washes your sins away if you also pray, just like tying a dastar and only tying a dastar and not doing anything else won't squeeze sins away either.

Did you not watch the video. Where it highlights the differences between both concepts? I know watching a video and absorbing Gurmat Gyan is against what you're Pandits teach you but try and bear with us.

Did u even watch the bloody video provided? It gives ample rebuttals to ur incorrect stance.

She never looks or even tries to read any other sources. Even if someone posts Gurbani she'll pretend it doesn't exist.

Guru Sahib abolished the Caste System but we have people like Preet who want to drag it back into Sikhism lol. I bet she's fine calling all Black People the "N" word and all other slave names as it's a part of History but it's ok as no one really means to use it to bring them lower down.

[Singhni MiriPiri]

Noo, that is not what it means. Regardless to wherever an (Indian) Sikh is from if he likes it or not his past identity's caste is still in the identity, meaning any Brahmin who reads it gets that knowledge, and Vaish does not mean Vaishnav. Vaishya is one of the 4 castes in ancient India. There are many castes but all castes are part of 1 of the 4 big caste groups such as Brahmin Kshytria Vaishya and Shudra. Vaish here refers to the Vaishya caste (landlords/farmers/shopkeepers etc).

Preeet, you said that you do not mind marrying out of caste? So what would your children’s caste be? Many people will begin to have mixed marriages, so what caste will they fall under? Shudra? It will be a past identity that will no longer be significant in anyone’s lives.

varanaa chihanaa baaharaa keemath kehi n sakaao ||

He has no color or mark; His Value cannot be estimated.

Vaheguru is described as having no caste. That is the quality a Gursikh should be striving. It would be demeaning as a Gursikh to actually believe we belong to a caste as we should be seeking to become a part of Vaheguru who is beyond castes.

[Singhni MiriPiri]

The caste of the shareer would fall under the respected husband's caste of course..

I agree with you on that. I just think our shareer has the caste, while out atma is casteless, if that makes sense to you. Regardless of any caste I believe anyone can do anything, everyone has a right to everything..! We are all equal after all, that includes all jiv jants.

Overtime our castes will become non-existent.

A true Gursikh would want to be regarded as belonging to Vaheguru irrespective of caste. If a Gursikh identifies themselves as their caste, then I take it that they want to be in the lowest form as a sikh. Their choice but I desire to be like Vaheguru.

[Singhni MiriPiri]

That's true. I like to be known as a Sikh, and caste doesn't play a big part anyways. If someone asks where my heritage is from though I'd tell them it, otherwise I wouldn't go around calling myself -caste here- Sikh.

Fair enough.

[S1ngh]

For Sikh Community - There is a problem in our community where *some* Sikhs hate people from Hindu religion blindly. It is wrong because Sikhs are not supposed to hate anyone regardless of any situation.

Hindu Community - Other side should also try to understand the reasoning behind such standpoint. Depriving a community for their basic human right for more than 60+ years, yes you should expect hatred from them. Majority of hindus do not see the way sikhs see these injustices.

Solution: Majority of hindus will be on Sikhs side for sure had they known the real un-biased information on injustices done against Sikhs and or punjab. We, Sikhs, rather than wasting our energy, we should mass produce the awareness of our issues. We really do need to work on it.

[Kira]

I think I forgot to mention that the issue is also gotra which is that no caste marries into their own gotra so how is that inbreeding hmm? How is that inbreeding if nobody marries their gotra aka family line?

Thank you for bringing up Family Line In one swipe you just undercut your entire argument.

Here you say.

Caste is what helps us from not becoming inbred people

But now you just affirmed that it's the family line which prevents interbreeding. Thank you for clearing that up and once again reasserting that the caste System is a pointless practice.

There are many Sri Gurdwara Sahibs situated by ancient rivers such as Saraswati ji, at Sri Kapal Mochan Sahib where many people take bathes as a tirith (although all Sri Gurdwaras with a Sarovar/Well/Rivers are considered pure spotless rivers.

There are Gurudwara's near Mandirs. Let's go and bow our heads toward the idols there too.

. Uh okay go ahead and post that, and I believe in that but our shareer aka vehicle does take part in it,

lmao really? so our Guru Sahib's had a caste? that they actively called themselves members of the said caste? Did you know the only name Guru Gobind Singh Ji added to his identity was Singh and then his family name if asked? He never once mentioned his caste? Why are you giving it so much importance. The Khalsa has no caste. You can't say Khalsa has no caste...BUT IF SOMEONE ASKS I'M OF TARKHAN ORIGIN. What a self contradictory way to think.

I want you to go a proper Geneticist and ask him to crack open your DNA. Now I want you to find the part of it which tells you which caste your from. Go ahead do it. Our Genes are what's given to us by the lord. Their what our Body will do, their what our Body will look like. So find me where in that it's inscribed about which caste someone belongs to.

that is why you always jump to assumtions without attaining nirvana and recieving paap prapti.

I don't remember you being a Brahmgyani that knows what I can or will receive. I've met a-lot of Sikhs on this forum. I've disagreed with many of them. But none of them have ever disrespected Gurbani and pushed it under a rug because it didn't fit their picture. None of them have ever tried changing and adding their own little things to Sikhism and tried to change the very fundamentals of Sikhism.

[Kira]

Lol the family line is in caste though, so..? Then why do some of our Sri Guru jis claim they are from the Sodhi Vansh

That was their family Name. Their caste (if they had chosen to refer to it) would have been Khatri but the fact they excluded it is point enough for any sane Sikh that the caste System is utterly pointless.

but nobody is stopping us Sikhs from taking ishnaan at rivers, we still go, and even cook in some rivers such as Sri Manikaran Sahib which is at Parvati Maa's River.

lmao what? are you going to follow what other Sikhs do or what Gurbani tells us? If all the Sikhs you know started doing Devi Pooja bowing towards idols would you start doing that too? and this time please don't start with "no they would never" just consider the distinctive Scenario.

and other things related to castes

lol what, which kinds of things lmao? You're logic is if the family is from or belonged to a certain caste people are then confined to that caste. In actaulity guru Nanak or his successors to his Jott never once referred to their caste. and what caste would someone from the Smith family fall under then? What about Someone from a Sekibo family. Please stop.

Just like how there are varieties/breeds of animals, there are varities of people. Me going to a geneticist is a waste of time since I know where my heritage is from already.

Go to a Geneticist. Find out what waheguru wants your caste to be. Look in your genes, you got them from Waheguru. Are you going to listen to what you're culture tells you or what God has prescribed. Look there and find me the genome which states what caste you are.

You've yet to address my point. are you saying the Guru Sahib's bodies also practiced the Caste System?

You're free to think what you want though, what can I expect from a person who uses profanity

What more would I expect from someone who holds what other humans state higher than what Gurbani states

[simran345]

Lol. Good answers Kira ji.

Preet hor videos twade le, dekla, not that you will bother to. ??

Jeri marji dekla, in case you don't miss one.

Sikhs don't believe in caste, your answer to Sodhi vansh.

Family names, so you don't end up marry ur cousin.

God doesn't look at our heritage, but our karm.

Aatam tirath vi zaroori a.

ਸਚੁ ਤਾਂ ਪਰੁ ਜਾਣੀਐ ਜਾ ਆਤਮ ਤੀਰਥਿ ਕਰੇ ਨਿਵਾਸੁ ॥: Sachu taan paru jaaneeai jaa aatam teerathi kare nivaasu: One knows the Truth (ਅਸਲੇ ਦੀ ਸਮਝ) only when he dwells in the sacred shrine of pilgrimage of his own Soul within. (sggs 468).

Oh and by the way, how on earth did the kara topic end up to caste topic? Kaul mathaul Kari ja sarian topics ???

Preet can you start a new thread if you are going to mix up all the topics, thank you ji