Do all paths that jap naam lead you back to akaal Purakh?

[Akalifauj]

12 hours ago, puzzled said:

So your saying ganika was a sikh prostitute? Why did she take advise from a sadhoo the? 

Im not talking about the hindu system  im talking about hindus remembering God and achieving mukti like the people I mentioned above.  If they remember god, like the hindus I mentioned above, then they too achieve mukti. 

Does Gurbani say she was a Sikh prostitute?  Gurbani says ganika learned to repeat the lord's name from a parrot. 

What makes a person a hindu; following the hindu system of religion which includes the vedas and worshipping one of the devta or devi's as the Lord. Gurbani speaks against this and only Naam simran on Akal Purkh is accepted. The Gurbani shabad of Bhagat kabir ji is clear.  Show us anywhere in Gurbani that says any one of the names you mentioned identified as hindu.  Gurbani is the truth and will not hide the true identity of ajmaal bhagat dhru, draupti, etc.  None of them in Gurbani are defined as hindus.  So why do you forcibly want to apply the hindu term on them?  

 

[puzzled]

1 hour ago, Akalifauj said:

Does Gurbani say she was a Sikh prostitute?  Gurbani says ganika learned to repeat the lord's name from a parrot. 

What makes a person a hindu; following the hindu system of religion which includes the vedas and worshipping one of the devta or devi's as the Lord. Gurbani speaks against this and only Naam simran on Akal Purkh is accepted. The Gurbani shabad of Bhagat kabir ji is clear.  Show us anywhere in Gurbani that says any one of the names you mentioned identified as hindu.  Gurbani is the truth and will not hide the true identity of ajmaal bhagat dhru, draupti, etc.  None of them in Gurbani are defined as hindus.  So why do you forcibly want to apply the hindu term on them?  

 

neither does gurbani say they were sikh,  sikhi didnt even exist when they existed. Gurbani mentions bhai lalo but does not mention him as a sikh, does that mean he was not a sikh then?     so you saying draupati was a sikh? lol Ok then.   like i said if a hindu remembers god like they did, they too will receive mukti. whats so hard to understand about that?     bhagat namdev ji was thrown out of the mandir and dragged to the back because he was of a low caste, why would he walk into the mandir in the first place if he wasn't a hindu?  And why did god turn the mandir around so that it faced bhagat namdev? 

hindu is a diverse belief system,not all hindus believe in devte or vedas. hinduism is so diverse that it even includes atheism. What your talking about is classical orthodox hinduism not all hindus adhere to that. couple of 100 yrs ago the word hindu didn't even exist, so what were they then?  hindu is a culture, a collection of a very diverse belief system. 

im honestly getting really bored talking about this ....  I think we've both put our points forward and made clear what we believe    original  poster can think for himself now  

[1Anonymous1]

Thanks for both of your inputs, really helped!

[Akalifauj]

19 hours ago, puzzled said:

neither does gurbani say they were sikh

 Who was ganika Guru?  Without satguru naam simran cannot be recieved.   Gurbani is very clear on this fact.

sikhi didnt even exist when they existed.

There is no difference between Gurbani and Vaheguru.   What you meant to say was Sikhi was not openly known on a wide scale at the time.  Sikhi always existed and will exist even when this universe cease to exist as Vaheguru absorbs it back into him.

[Akalifauj]

Gurbani mentions bhai lalo but does not mention him as a sikh, does that mean he was not a sikh then? 

Bhai lalo stayed with saroop of  Sri Guru Nanak Dev ji.   Bhai Lalo was a companion of Sri Guru Nanak Dev ji.  Can you find Gurbani saying bhai Lalo was not a Sikh.  We can find in Gurbani, Sri chand did not listen to Sri Guru Nanak Dev ji.  So if Bhai Lalo would have done the same or similar.  We would have discovered it Gurbani.  Such Gurbani does not exist.  To call Bhai Lalo  a Sikh is not baseless or without merit.  However to call ganika a hindu is completely baseless.   By her job she was identified as a prostitute. Which religious text of the Hindus says to be a prostitute and you are still a practicing hindu? No where in Gurbani does anyone of the contributors say she is a hindu.  Her behavior described in Gurbani does not say hindu or anything close.  So it's fair to say she was not a hindu.

you saying draupati was a sikh? lol Ok then.

I did not say or infer she is a Sikh.  You have a problem with making assumptions to help your view point.  But every time you attempt this foolish behavior you get caught on it.  I have been asking you to provide Gurbani to say Hindus have Satguru and therefore can attain Naam simran.  You brought up ganika because you wanted to pin her as a hindu.  I asked for proof from Gurbani to say she was a hindu.  You could not provide anything.  Then you wanted to provide more names and I asked for proof from Gurbani and you can't provide proof.  

like i said if a hindu remembers god like they did, they too will receive mukti. whats so hard to understand about that? 

Soon as you  say hindu your view point goes out the window.  A practicing hindu will not worship Vaheguru (the one supreme Being).  They will worship a devta or devi or like you add no God.  All three worships is not of Vaheguru, therefore they are not remembering God and cannot receive mukhti.  

bhagat namdev ji was thrown out of the mandir and dragged to the back because he was of a low caste, why would he walk into the mandir in the first place if he wasn't a hindu?  And why did god turn the mandir around so that it faced bhagat namdev?

God did many things for Bhagat Naamdev ji.  You should read about them in bhai gurdas ji Vaar and see where bhagat ji is referred to as a Gurmukh.   Walking into a mandir does not make anyone a hindu. A hindu walking into a Gurdwara does not make them a Sikh. Why are you hell bent on calling these great souls as Hindu when they did not define themselves as hindu?

hindu is a diverse belief system,not all hindus believe in devte or vedas. hinduism is so diverse that it even includes atheism. What your talking about is classical orthodox hinduism not all hindus adhere to that. couple of 100 yrs ago the word hindu didn't even exist, so what were they then?  hindu is a culture, a collection of a very diverse belief system. 

Hindu being a diverse group means nothing. You say hindu includes even atheism. You made the blanketed statement hindus have Raam naam, so what is an atheist hindu remembering when he doesn't believe in God? Can you provide the information I have been asking for? That this diverse group as Satguru and therefore do naam simran? If you can provide this information the discussion would have been finished. The fact is, you have no information to say Hindus have Satguru. So you have been beating around the Bush trying to throw up smoke screens. None of this worked.

[T_Singh]

In Kalyug only the naam given by Guru Nanak Patshah will save you.  

Other names of Vaaheguru are from the other yugs which can be chanted however, Vaaheguru is the Gurmantar for kalyug.  
 

Sabh Tai Vada Satgur Nanak Jin kal Rakhi Meri

Guru Nanak is the greatest of all; he saved my honour in this dark age of Kali Yuga.   - Guru Granth Sahib Jee ang 750

 

[Akalifauj]

2 hours ago, T_Singh said:

In Kalyug only the naam given by Guru Nanak Patshah will save you.  

Other names of Vaaheguru are from the other yugs which can be chanted however, Vaaheguru is the Gurmantar for kalyug.  
 

Sabh Tai Vada Satgur Nanak Jin kal Rakhi Meri

Guru Nanak is the greatest of all; he saved my honour in this dark age of Kali Yuga.   - Guru Granth Sahib Jee ang 750

 

The Gurbani you have quoted does not say only in kalyug.  That is your own belief.  Naam simran is not about some chanting one word.  Vaheguru and the word Raam are no lesser or greater from each other.  It is the Gurmat meaning that makes them great.  In today's world the Mantar Vaheguru is being used in various ways.  For example, Vaheguru is the baba lying dead in a tomb, but the followers chant Vaheguru to remember this dead fake baba.  Vaheguru is gurmantar, but now it's meaning has been changed to praise a fake dead baba, who liked to draw Shiva ling. Others cults have taken on a similar method.  Raam was given to remember the One Supreme Being, but the Hindus started chanting Raam for raamchadr, who was not Vaheguru.  They focused on the dead as well.  From age to age this has been the primary problem.   

[1Anonymous1]

Akalifauj, could you share some light on people of other faiths and paths experiencing stuff in simran which is described in Gurbani. 
 

My extended family members haven’t had gurmantar from Panj Pyare, however they have experienced stuff very similar to sikhi if not the same. 

[FreshMind13]

As others have stated, Gurmantar from Guru Nanak Dev Ji is the one that will give you mukti.

Other mantars and sadhus have reached, with intense bhagti to Karam Khand, but without Gurprasad, they did not reach Sachkhand until they came to the house of Guru Sahib.

[Akalifauj]

16 hours ago, 1Anonymous1 said:

Akalifauj, could you share some light on people of other faiths and paths experiencing stuff in simran which is described in Gurbani. 
 

My extended family members haven’t had gurmantar from Panj Pyare, however they have experienced stuff very similar to sikhi if not the same. 

What are they experiencing?  Sounds? Seeing the future? Obtaining what they desire?  If they were experiencing something spiritual as Gurmat describes they would fall at the feet of Punj Pyare and take amrit.