Ustat-the main reason behind success of baba culture

[shastarSingh]

3 minutes ago, Ranjeet01 said:

There have  always been these sant baba types in Punjab but it seems that over the last few decades it has mushroomed.

I think that this could be due certain factors:

As Punjab has got more materialistic and people have become more aspirational, this has resulted in increased problems such as health, wealth etc and people have got more desperate.

So they have fallen into the trap of going to these babas for a quick fix of their problems.

I wonder when there was less of rat race, less materialism, less complications and generally more contentment whether people followed these babas

 

We must also question the present day education. Is it really education?

Present generation is more educated than previous one and u expect them to be less fuddu and superstitious but it's the opposite.

Even a bhainchod kanjar like ram rahim got so many doctors and engineers etc to be his chellaas.

[Ranjeet01]

2 minutes ago, shastarSingh said:

We must also question the present day education. Is it really education?

Present generation is more educated than previous one and u expect them to be less fuddu and superstitious but it's the opposite.

Even a bhainchod kanjar like ram rahim got so many doctors and engineers etc to be his chellaas.

Sometimes the more educated you are, the easier you are to brainwash.

You spend years following instruction and not thinking critically. Your common sense gets knocked out of you.

Padhe Likhe Bewakoof

It is unpadh bandheh that are harder to fool sometimes

[dallysingh101]

21 minutes ago, Ranjeet01 said:

There is a simple way, just don't bother with the sant babas. Go straight to the source, take out the middle man

That requires a certain degree of intelligence.

Put simply, our quom (especially rural lot) has an allergy to reading by the looks of it. I understand in the past, with high levels of illiteracy in certain groups, they might have had to fully rely on exposition via spoken presentations (katha), but now? It's just some form of mental laziness by the looks of it?

Plus, even if we got over that. From what I've read over the years, a lot of the books available are biased and corrupted themselves. A lot of them in the past pushed some 'Sikhism is modren religion' that lined it up with western secular thinking (which probably explains why we have so many of these types today?)   

It's like there is a lot of work to be done, and a lot of what has been done isn't particularly useful. 

[dallysingh101]

4 minutes ago, Ranjeet01 said:

It is unpadh bandheh that are harder to fool sometimes

I think it's that sociopathic trait;  makes them untrusting and skeptical because they view most people as corrupted like themselves? 

[Ranjeet01]

7 minutes ago, dallysingh101 said:

That requires a certain degree of intelligence.

Put simply, our quom (especially rural lot) has an allergy to reading by the looks of it. I understand in the past, with high levels of illiteracy in certain groups, they might have had to fully rely on exposition via spoken presentations (katha), but now? It's just some form of mental laziness by the looks of it?

Plus, even if we got over that. From what I've read over the years, a lot of the books available are biased and corrupted themselves. A lot of them in the past pushed some 'Sikhism is modren religion' that lined it up with western secular thinking (which probably explains why we have so many of these types today?)   

It's like there is a lot of work to be done, and a lot of what has been done isn't particularly useful. 

The rural lot can recite path off by heart. They know a lot of bani and have since childhood, they aren't stupid by any stretch of the imagination.

If you have a path tape on and they walk in midway, they will recite word for word

[dallysingh101]

5 minutes ago, Ranjeet01 said:

The rural lot can recite path off by heart. They know a lot of bani and have since childhood, they aren't stupid by any stretch of the imagination.

If you have a path tape on and they walk in midway, they will recite word for word

I think you just explained it. Rote repetition, with no deep conviction. 

What seems to happen commonly (from what I've seen), is that they start to view bani as some sort of mantra to gain the material goals they want. 

I've seen people switch babay because one wasn't getting them the results they wanted! lol 

There is some recognition of these characteristics by some apnay, but they are a minority. 

[Ranjeet01]

As the expression goes , "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink"

You could say ,"You can lead someone to Bani but you can't make them Gurmat"

 

[Premi5]

I think use of bani for spiritual improvement would be much better if everyone listened to high level of katha. Seems kathavachaks go less to pinds where there is less money.

I think majority of Sikh who read bani, even in West don't have a good/deep understanding of meaning

I think the 'baba culture' is partly related to Sikhi having strong emphasis on needing a Guru. 

[Premi5]

Just now, Premi5 said:

I think use of bani for spiritual improvement would be much better if everyone listened to high level of katha. Seems kathavachaks go less to pinds where there is less money.

I think majority of Sikh who read bani, even in West don't have a good/deep understanding of meaning

I think the 'baba culture' is partly related to Sikhi having strong emphasis on needing a Guru. 

'Guru' as per mentioned in bani

[MisterrSingh]

3 hours ago, Premi5 said:

I think use of bani for spiritual improvement would be much better if everyone listened to high level of katha.

I know (or knew) of people who would never miss a Sant Singh Maskeen katha smagam or a Bhai Pinderpal Singh appearance. They'd sit in the sangat with their eyes closed in utter samadhi for hours. However, these same people were also dabblers in black magic and had a pandit baba on speed dial.

What affect has the elite level of katha available to Sikhs managed to do for these people?