muslims hoping Sikhs will help them against hindus.... i think not

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22 minutes ago, SikhKosh said:

Also don't forget, since you support massive parchar among Jaats, for every Manoj Duhan you have a Vishal Jood who attacks Sikhs.

If you had a Bhutto, you also had Zia.

Vishal Jood is not a Jaat he is a Ror who variously claim to be Rajputs or descendants of the Maratha refugees from the battle of Panipat. 

[SikhKosh]

He is a Haryanvi supported by Jaats - don't tell me the people who cheered on him were not Jaats or the ones who fought with Sikhs in Australia were all non-Jaat Haryanvis. Like this Jaat hating on other Jaats for embracing Sikhi or the thousands of Jaats who massacred Sikhs and raped their women in Delhi 1984.

 

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13 minutes ago, SikhKosh said:

1971 broke Paks back bone. They would never have succesfully invaded India in 1984. They would've suffered a defeat like in 1971.

Zia Ul Haq being a Jalandhari Punjabi had more affinity with Sikhs than Benazir Bhutto who had Sindhi and Kurdish ancestry. Him or his ancestors being kicked out of Jalandhar does not mean he held grudges against them. Go on youtube and see thousands of Pak Muslims and Indian Sikhs who were from the other side of the border still remember their ancestral lands and friends with nostalgia despite personally suffering from 1947, unlike you or myself.

If Zia did not have sympathy with Sikhs, he would have just opened training camps for militants in Pak without further opening any Gurdwaras. Remember that this was the 80s, Sikh diaspora was weak unlike now so he did not have to feign support to Sikhs to win brownie points. Yet he went out of his way to open Gurdwaras like Panja Sahib and others. Ask any elder Sikh who went to Pak in the 70s 80s and how they were received with warmth by Zia.

Pakistan by 1984 had received massive amounts of military aid and was not a basket case militarily. 1971 was a two front war which Pakistan could never have won. In 1984, the Pakistan army would have had support from the Sikhs in Punjab as well as the very real possibility of a Sikh mutiny. In 1984 the Sikhs were at least 25% of the army and even now they are 10-12%. Only after the 1984 mutiny did the Indian govt lower the number of Sikhs in the army. Apart from the Sikhs in the army, there were tens of thousands of retired Sikhs from the army living in the villages of Punjab who had the military skills to create an insurgency in Punjab behind the Indian army's front line. If Zia's aim was to avenge the creation of Bangladesh he had the perfect opportunity in 1984. 

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4 minutes ago, SikhKosh said:

He is a Haryanvi supported by Jaats - don't tell me the people who cheered on him were not Jaats or the ones who fought with Sikhs in Australia were all non-Jaat Haryanvis. Like this Jaat hating on other Jaats for embracing Sikhi or the thousands of Jaats who massacred Sikhs and raped their women in Delhi 1984.

 

Have you actually read any of the comments on this videos? How many are by Jaats supporting him and how many are by non-Jaats.

I don't know how many were Jaats who were involved with supporting Jood but the fighting in Australia was presented as a Haryana Vs Punjab fight and as such we would expect some Jaats be be on the Haryana side. This Dabas guy is an anomaly, out of step with what is happening in the Jaat community now. 

[SikhKosh]

14 minutes ago, proactive said:

Pakistan by 1984 had received massive amounts of military aid and was not a basket case militarily. 1971 was a two front war which Pakistan could never have won. In 1984, the Pakistan army would have had support from the Sikhs in Punjab as well as the very real possibility of a Sikh mutiny. In 1984 the Sikhs were at least 25% of the army and even now they are 10-12%. Only after the 1984 mutiny did the Indian govt lower the number of Sikhs in the army. Apart from the Sikhs in the army, there were tens of thousands of retired Sikhs from the army living in the villages of Punjab who had the military skills to create an insurgency in Punjab behind the Indian army's front line. If Zia's aim was to avenge the creation of Bangladesh he had the perfect opportunity in 1984. 

If 1971 was a two front war, 1984 was no better because the entire region had turned turbulent post 1979. The Khomeini situation in Iran, Soviet Afghan war and so on, Paks were also on several fronts at that time. In fact, air force of Pak was dominated by Bangladeshis that is why they were able to give a stiff resistance to India in 1965 - to the extent that the war is declared a stalemate by many historians. Paks had lost a lot of advantages both as an army and psychologically post their distintegration in 1971. Can you imagine your army surrending without a fight and your nation being broked into two ? Paki POWs was largest number of POWs post 2nd world war. Pak psyche is scarred to this day by 71, so 84 would've been to early for them to attempt another misadventure.

[SikhKosh]

1 minute ago, proactive said:

Have you actually read any of the comments on this videos? How many are by Jaats supporting him and how many are by non-Jaats.

I don't know how many were Jaats who were involved with supporting Jood but the fighting in Australia was presented as a Haryana Vs Punjab fight and as such we would expect some Jaats be be on the Haryana side. This Dabas guy is an anomaly, out of step with what is happening in the Jaat community now. 

If you base your opinions on comments then go read comment of Pakis on youtube videos of Sikh pilgrims to Pak as well.

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2 minutes ago, SikhKosh said:

If 1971 was a two front war, 1984 was no better for back because the entire region had turned turbulent post 1979. The Khomeini situation in Iran, Soviet Afghan war and so on, Paks were also on several fronts at that time. In fact, air force of Pak was dominated by Bangladeshis that is why they were able to give a stiff resistance to India in 1965 - to the extent that the war is declared a stalemate by many historians. Paks had lost a lot of advantages both as an army and psychologically post their distintegration in 1971. Can you imagine your army surrending without a fight and your nation being broked into two ? Paki POWs was largest number of POWs post 2nd world war. Pak psyche is scarred to this day by 71, so 84 would've been to early for them to attempt another misadventure.

The Russians were bogged down in Afghanistan. Iranian revolution had not yet affected the Sunni-Shia relationship in Pakistan. You obviously have no understanding of just how difficult it is for an army to be fighting on the front like knowing that behind them is not a supportive population that they had in 1965  who had then risked their lives to send them food but a hostile population which hated them.  Not only this the Indian army would not have been able to trust 25% of their men and these 25% would be men from the elite fighting units.

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10 minutes ago, SikhKosh said:

If you base your opinions on comments then go read comment of Pakis on youtube videos of Sikh pilgrims to Pak as well.

The Jaats responding to Dabas videos have no political agenda. The Muslims swooning over Sikh pilgrims have a political agenda which includes having gullible Sikhs form of a buffer to defend the Indian Muslims from the Hindutvis and the continuation of the demographic jihad against Punjab. 

[SikhKosh]

Just now, proactive said:

The Russians were bogged down in Afghanistan. Iranian revolution had not yet affected the Sunni-Shia relationship in Pakistan. You obviously have no understanding of just how difficult it is for an army to be fighting on the front like knowing that behind them is not a supportive population that they had in 1965  who had then risked their lives to send them food but a hostile population which hated them.  Not only this the Indian army would not have been able to trust 25% of their men and these 25% would be men from the elite fighting units.

You're naive to assume all Sikhs would've jumped sides had Pak attacked India. Who crushed the Kharku movement ? It was not the Brahmins or Muslims but Sikhs themselves.

How many Sikh soldiers mutinied in 1984 ? I know many did, but did all do like you claim in your idealistic percentage figures in case of a Pak invasion? Did even a majority of Sikh soldiers mutiny ? Please provide figures.

[SikhKosh]

13 minutes ago, proactive said:

The Jaats responding to Dabas videos have no political agenda. The Muslims swooning over Sikh pilgrims have a political agenda which includes having gullible Sikhs form of a buffer to defend the Indian Muslims from the Hindutvis and the continuation of the demographic jihad against Punjab. 

Did the Jaats who massacre Sikhs and kidnap their women 3 decades back have any agenda ? 

Now that they are sidelined by Khatris in politics they are feeling used and abused by the centre and Arya Samajis and are thus turning towards the very Punjabi Sikhs they opposed at every instance during the last 6 decades.

See how easy it is to generalise ^