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This story comes to mind in addition to my post:

Due to recent tirade of self-promoter dya singh against sri akal takht by attending a meeting hosted/arranged by SCUK will only damage the relation of sri akal takht sahib and SCUK. Regardless of how frustrating the work nature is in the office of sri akal takht sahib, i would highly recommend that years of hard work by such organization should not be held down by involving outsiders. I agree that Akal Takht sahib and its sewadars are not doing 90% of their job but however we should keep trying until we get what we want. The reason i am posting this is because i like what scuk foks are doing but wanted to advice/warn them of not involving outsiders in internal meetings. I know founding members of scuk occasionally look at this website, so hence my post. Involving people like dya singh is certainly a bad choice. he once said that kachera should have zipper or wearing boxer shorts is same as wearing kachera. http://www.sikhnet.com/news/akal-takhat-stirred-not-shaken-op-ed

'As a perfect Saint’s (Sadhu) heart is like an ocean of compassion which recognizes the pain of others and is always there to help. Baba Ji listening to her plight instantly told the lady to find two ladders, meanwhile assessing the house on fire they found that the lower floor of the house had been severely burnt and the upper was yet inflames. Unable to find a rope Baba Ji took off his turban and tied the two ladders together in order to reach a small window on the upper floor and began to climb up. Sant Lal Singh Ji worried for their safety told Baba Ji not to climb up, as the fire was too intense and he was risking his own life. But Baba Ji whilst reciting prays had begun to climb up to the upper floor. He went in quickly, picked up the child and wrapped him in a blanket and tied him to his waist and then grabbed some of the ladies possessions and threw them down to her and carefully climbed out of the window with the child and down the ladder, placing that fortunate child into the longing arms of his mother' Taken from Pachmi Parkash, Baba Karam Singh Ji I'm not justyfing bollywood aswell and don't agree with any of their movies, but just highlighting the point of taking your dastaar off to save someone's life isn't going to be beadbi to the dastaar.

Daduwal has no sikhi interest left in him as he is in bed with radhaswami sect. He was again in their gurinder's dera few days ago. He should be stripped off from representing Sikhs in India. As sant ji said in one of his speeches, " do not raise your hand and join our movement if you are the follower of Radha swami and other pakhandi babay".

I believe it is all about style, ex. women like pink color but majority men will never wear anything pink. Women salwar kammeez is similar to male kurta pajama, so imagine Singh wearing flowery kurta pajama... I know u won't see that.. So in the end it's more culture influence over turban style based on gender. Plus nok (triangle) paag is maharaja sher singh's invention in 1800's.

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH Nothing stopping them from a Sikhi perspective. Would be unique and look different from others, but nothing in terms of style has been designated to one gender vs another.

Some kid whose father is a decorated General in the armed forces goes to the same school where the son of a stick-wielding police constable (havaldaar) also studies. Now which one of these 2 would be more proud of his father? Obviously the son of a General! How does this make the havaldaars son feel? Obviously intimidated and perhaps even inferior! How do such people then react? They try every attempt to mock or humiliate someone who is way ahead of them in any aspect life. Some kid loves his father to death because he knows his father sacrificed so much just to give him a decent upbringing and a good education. Another kid doesnt even know who his father was, because his father left his mother before this kid was even born. Now which of these 2 will never tolerate any insult to his father? Obviously the first kid, because he owes everything to his father! This is the difference between the Sikhs and others, and this is the reason why were facing all these various sorts of troubles all over this world. Whether its the problems we face at the hands of Hindus in India, or Muslims in Islamic countries, or gorey/kaale/others in Western countries, this difference is the central issue at the core. We are proud of our Guru Sahibaan, our Puratan Singhs, our mahaan Sants, Sipahis and our Shaheeds. We are proud of their glorious legacy. Those who dont have such a history, or have a shameful history full of oppression and barbarity will always have a problem with us just like the son of a havaldaar has with the son of a General. The Generals son has pictures of his dad in uniform decked with medals. The son of a havaldaar knows his father doesnt even have a rifle. The Generals son can tell stories of how his dad won so many battles and faced the enemy fearlessly. What will the havaldaars son say? How his father beat up an innocent protester? Or how his havaldaar dad got slapped by a girl because he passed a lewd remark? What else can such people do besides cracking Sardar jokes? We are proud of our turbans, our beards, our 5 kakaars, because these are blessings of our Guru Sahibaan. Those who dont even know whom to worship/follow, what do they have in life that they can value? They are like that kid who never knew who/what his father was/is? Thus they have a problem with our turban, and they want it taken off at all airport checkpoints. They have a problem with our kara/kirpan and want these removed before we board buses. Why they have this problem? Because these poor fellows are like that fatherless kid who never knew what it means to get a gift from a dad. They dont have a blessing like Sikhi in their lives, they dont have a father like Kalgidhar Patshah Ji, they dont have anything such as the Khalsa appearance or the 5 kakaars which they can call as gifts. But since we do, they have a problem with these. What else can they do except try to rob us of these? Khalsa ji, do not take Sikhi for granted. Please dont! This whole world is full of ashamed and fatherless people who do not have anything to be proud of, or anything to value in their lives. We have everything! Our Guru Sahibaan, the priceless jewel of Gurbani, our Puratan Singhs/Kaurs, our itihaas, our Gurmat philosophy, these are all like those medals which the Generals son is so proud of. These are all those gifts which a loving fathers beloved son holds near and dear to his heart and soul. Those who dont have such a father, or those who dont even know about their father, they always have, they still do, and they always will have a problem with the Khalsa! Mehtab Singh Nov. 4th, 2013

A Sikh man in the US will receive USD 50,000 as compensation to settle a religious discrimination lawsuit against a car dealership in New Jersey for denying him a job for maintaining a beard. Gurpreet Kherha had filed a discrimination charge with the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) and a lawsuit in 2009 against Tri-County Lexus, where he had applied for a position as a sales associate and was qualified for the job. EEOC said after the car dealership requested Kherha to shave his beard, he refused to comply due to his religious beliefs. The dealership denied him the job, the agency charged. According to the lawsuit, Tri-County Lexus had a "no-beard" policy for sales and administrative personnel and it strictly enforced its dress code policy without granting reasonable religious accommodations. The lawsuit was filed on behalf of Kherha by rights group Sikh Coalition and the EEOC. Under the settlement reached in the case, the car dealership would pay USD 50,000 to Kherha and the firm has been urged not to discriminate on the basis of religion in future. Tri-County has also entered into a two-year consent decree with the federal government under which it is required to undertake a series of "remedial" measures including revising its written policies and procedures prohibiting employment discrimination and providing anti-discrimination training to employees and management. It is also required to post a notice regarding the resolution of the lawsuit. http://www.financialexpress.com/news/sikh-man-to-get-50000-in-religious-discrimination-case/1197289

lol...o prava tu style di gal karda...sir te chunni ya simple dastaar hi ban len ohi boht waddi gal a....styla nu chad para......

Thats not true as baani clearly say 'prabh ke simran ridh sidh nau nidh. Ridhian sidhian is also a different type of magic/spiritual power that a person develops through kamaii. Black magic on the otherhand does exist but the basic premise is that it comes back three fold on the person who does it. It CAN be done by getting someones picture, just how some people use voodoo dolls to focus on the person they wish to curse. But again, by doing simran, reading gurbani can negate or dramatically reduce the effects as nothing can compare to Guru Sahibs protection Sukhmani sahib is extremely effective in countering any negative effects caused by it.

Didn't Sikh soldiers remove their turbans to cover clotheless ladies who were being abused by the Pak army in Bangladesh during the 1971 war? Not justifying Bollywood.

Similar sakhi comes in sikhi as well Does anyone remember the sakhi from sooraj parkash... during sri guru gobind singh ji time where two group of sikhs wanted to go to mela but one can go..one had to do seva of guru maharaj ..sri guru gobind singh ji sent one group of people to test and others were not too happy. So after the mela group came back..both groups were called in guru maharaj darbar..the group that went to mela were addressed- o sikhs you guys are great, during your time spent in mela your mind was attached to my lotus feet, you were thinking about me , you guys were bairaagi you guys were gurmukh maya vich udasi now guru maharaj addressed to the group which was in hazaar nazaar in sri guru gobind singh ji hazoori doing seva, guru maharaj said even though you were physically present in guru maharaj darbar try to do seva physically, your mind was wandering in mela, have all sort of thoughts things in mela...in this way guru maharaj gave updesh to both groups.

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH Sorry..wrong Gursikh. :ohno:

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH Was about to reply a whole counter-argument but decided that what needs to be said has been said. I hope to not have to reply again to this thread, as I have learned that they simply snowball and get out of hand. In person discussions are worth more time, more respectful and you can look a person in the eye and talk like Gursikhs. The internet does not afford that opportunity. Bhai N30 Singh, best of luck in your research, Sikhi Marag and raising your children to be Chardi Kalaa Gursikhs. Singh559 Jio...if you want to discuss this, I will gladly continue at GNP whenever you want. Maybe I will buy a Kirpan off of you yet? :blush2:

From my blog: http://back2sikhi.blogspot.com/2010/02/getting-used-to-gazes.html. Please comment on what you think - what are some challenges to keeping hair in the West? Benefits? Why do we do it? When people ask me about my long hair, I tell them that I have never cut it because of my religion. That is true about the hair on my head, but not about the hair elsewhere on my body. That is - I have shaved, waxed, and threaded. Does this make me a bad person? I am not sure. Clearly, 98% of the rest of "my world" - particularly the females - remove their body hair. And most of these people are not, necessarily, "bad". Do I feel guilty about it? To be honest - not really. It was something I went through to fit in. But my actions were still in line with Sikhi: nam japna, vand chakna, kirt karni. About 2 years ago, after much meditation, I slowly stopped these hair-removing processes. It wasn't something that I woke up and immediately decided. It just kind of happened. And with Guru's grace, I have been entirely okay with it. The only thing that has taken some getting used to is the stares. I generally keep my body covered, but I also like to swim. My swimming suit, if you will, involves shorts and a t-shirt. A lot of people - especially women - stare at my legs. It's as though they are willing me to feel bad about my choice to keep my hair. Yet I do not give in to their desire to make me feel ashamed. I actually find my choice liberating and motivating, not to mention economical. Sikhs are supposed to be leaders - leaders do not care about what other people think when they know what they are doing in their heart is right. I am also saving money on these "cosmetic supplies" - money that adds up when you notice that the "treatments" are lifelong. Is there a reason that our hair keeps growing back no matter how much we try to stop it? Why not give in to the way Waheguru has made our bodies? The most exciting part about this, however, is the opportunities it brings up to educate my brothers and sisters. When I catch people, especially children, staring at me, I look back and smile. If these people ask me questions, I have this golden chance to explain to people that I am a Sikh, and talk about the basic principles of our religion. Several years ago, when I did shave my legs, I did not have this confidence. Now, ironically, when I am subject to public scrutiny, I do believe - in myself, in humanity, in Waheguru.

The ad wasn't produced to get Sikh customers, all Gap chains have this image. Please see the first few pages where n30 posted a facebook link of a Gap employee's story of a racist lady ranting going viral, it in effect educated A LOT of people on Sikhi by merely googling who Sikhs are. When they google who Sikhs are they will see exactly who Sikhs are, not what kind of gandh Waris does on his own time. In that picture he is merely a Sikh individual with his wife (in my eyes). If anything, they may have lost business because of it, but they made a bold positive statement by taking this risk in promoting plurality. Frankly speaking we don't have the organization as a Panth nor would we have the voice to be sought after as customers by a large corporation so the idea to protest will only cause them to not feature a Sikh in the future most likely. If anything Mr Ahluwalia should individually be approached and ask him whether he could pose alone without a female to avoid getting bad press because once this hits the mainstream, I guarantee those involved in asking for the change will be viewed in a negative light, right or wrong, that's just how western society is. So far your response has been the most level minded that not only I can take seriously, but also respect. Appreciate your feedback on the thread. Thank you for pointing that out, that's the main thing that really put me off and inspired me to make this thread. Gursant isn't level minded at all and IF someone were to start promoting a more Sikh-like image in the mainstream, it must be done by intelligent individuals who can speak in the mainstream without looking like a joke by both our own community and the general public - I can not think of anyone currently who is up for the job, nor do I know exactly how this would be done. ------------ Hypothetically speaking, what if someone who is not your wife asks to take a picture with you and asks to hug you during the picture. Is that also considered anti Gurmat since she is touching you and isn't your wife? If a GurSikh is like the kamal who remains untouched by the filth of the world, would he have any reason to object? I think if someone objected it would show suppression more than anything which can be worse in some cases.I can think of Baba Fauja Singh ji (the 102 year old runner) where he hugs some gorian and openly talks about it in a humorous manner, now is everyone going to say Fauja Singh is indulging in kaam? No way, that's ridiculous. Yes, I know that Waris probably is indulging in anti-Sikh behavior, but isolating this particular picture - i still stand firm that it is not provocative. The only possible issue I can see is that she is touching his dastar, but I said it before that if a wife can help do pagh di pooni (for those who tie nok dastaaran) why can't she touch it if given permission? I just see the picture as an artistic portrayal of a Sikh couple and that's exactly what Gap was going for.

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH N30 Bhai Sahib, your kamai may be bearing fruit - you are becoming AntarJami and looking into my mind. :biggrin2: I had this picture in mind when responding to this topic. First, I am going to again reiterate that I am not in favor of a protest. But discerning right from wrong, and as a community, approaching individuals of the community to gently advise if something is not within Gurmat (and that applies to Mr. Ahluwalia). Bhai Jagmeet Singh has done more seva in a few minutes that I probably can do in 1000 lifetimes. BUT that does not absolve him from review by the Sikhs he represents. We must again apply the test of Gurmat - is the cover within the scope of treating the women in contact with his person like sisters/mothers/daughters? He has women next to him, and I cannot see that the woman in the black dress is making physical contact with him (can't see her arm through his arms). It appears that they are not engaging in physical contact with him in a fashion that can be seen as provocative. It is not in the same category as Mr. Ahluwalia from the overall setup (clearly making physical contact with him). Yes, it is "interesting" that only women are being portrayed along Bhai Sahib, and I think he would be best served to express very careful judgement on any media shots he is the spotlight of and keep the principle of mothers/daughters/sisters in mind at all times. The better question for all to ask at all times is if we believe that Guru Sahib is with us at all times (Gur Mere Sang Sadaa Hai Nalae), would what we are doing be considered appropriate? Now, what this should not turn into is a "What about this picture" scenario where every picture of a Sikh with a woman is reviewed. The test of Gurmat is there and can be applied by all. Similarly, we have the reference of Mahapurakhs such as Baba Nand SIngh, who instructed all Bibian that were coming to the thaath that they should be accompanied by a brother or male relative so as to preserve a decent, respectful atmosphere conducive to Bhagti and not conducive to the Punj Vikaars. We have Baba Harnaam Singh Rampur Khera, who was given the lesson to always look down at his feet by an elder Gursikh, which he stated saved him from a lot of vikaars. We should at least look up those role models that have achieved something truly in Sikhi and attempt to better our lives based on their life.

The images of Waris with women have been deleted as people of all ages surf the forum. We appreciate you bringing these pictures to light because they contribute to the thread, but due to the explicit and inappropriate nature of the images, we unfortunately have to remove them.

Oh lord, those are some embarrassing pictures. If anything like that was made as a Gap ad, no one would support it and I would be vehemently against it. Personally speaking I view the Gap ad as an artistic portrayal of a Singh in society with what would be his life partner and he had given permission to touch the dastar. I still firmly believe the Gap picture is open to interpretation and wasn't of malintent. That's where I stop defending him because I never seen those pictures before, but still my view of the image is unchanged. I do not view the Gap picture to be provocative. The main reason I'm passionately against Gursant's protest of this is because, in short, it makes Sikhs look like a joke in the mainstream - something like <Edited> muslims on Muslim patrol. It's a sensitive issue and I don't think we should really protest the Gap ad, but be weary of him in the future. I lost a lot of respect for him seeing those pictures.

http://www.viralnova.com/pope-kisses-man/ From facebook quote:

Sikhi isn't against being a male and female. There is a difference and this hippy feminism stuff destroys basic gender rolls constricted by biology. Generally speaking nok dastar and whatnot seem more masculine, but a bibi can wear a dastar just as a male. In India in taksal many bibi wear and have worn chunni instead of dastar.

i think comparing the shaheeds and gurus to someone like waris alhuwalia is completely out of context and doesn't make sense at all i could say why you driving a car - the shaheeds never would have a done that you shouldn't watch movies as none of the shaheeds ever watched movies why are you playing xbox when have the Gurus ever played xbox ????? what you work in a superstore? no guru ever worked in tesco ??? or why do you live in a semi detached house? none of the shaheeds ever lived in Semi Detatched houses - get a tent or a mud hut why do you use a mobile .... etc you get the idea i mean its ridiculous..... the singh is portraying Sikhs in a positive light and the female is totally respectable and any eroticism is induced by the viewers own perceptions, and not intended. This is also evident by the fact that it doesn't come across in a negative way to a majority of NORMAL people. And i do agree its not a crime to be handsome - i have had to live with this affliction most of my life and i will make no excuses for it - its just the way Guruji made me Singhs should have ROAB, look handsome and look like princes and why shouldn't women feel attracted to Singh's

Plz can anybody record and upload it plz

Dubious game by Zail, Buta, alleges former cop New Delhi : Retired Punjab Police chief Kirpal Dhillon has blamed late President Zail Singh and former Home Minister Buta Singh for dubious attempts to sabotage the Rajiv-Longowal accord signed in 1985 to put behind the Sikh terrorism that had then engulfed the state. He has also blamed KPS Gill, the then IG of Punjab, in his book published early this week for lapses in security that led to the killing of Akali Dal chief Harchand Singh Longowal in August 1985 and blames then Governor late Arjun Singh for giving rise to militancy in the post-Bluestar days. Longowal had credibility among Hindus and Sikhs. This did not suit Zail Singh and Buta Singh and their supporters in the Punjab Congress, who had been playing a dubious game to negate whatever Longowal and Rajiv Gandhi (then PM) were trying to achieve. Dhillon, a 1953 batch IPS officer of Madhya Pradesh cadre, has penned his memoirs: Time present and time past memories of top cop. Handpicked by then PM Indira Gandhi, Dhillon was posted as the DGP of Punjab on July 3, 1984, a month after Operation Bluestar at the Golden Temple in Amritsar. He accuses Zail-Buta duo of promoting the family of Sant Jarnail Singh Bhindranwale in the post-Bluestar days like in 1978 when Bhindranwale was projected as counterfoil the Akalis. They, after the death of Bhindranwale, zeroed in on his father Joginder Singh. Dhillon writes that Joginder Singh nd his outfit, the United Akali Dal, was used to derail the April 30, 1985 meeting of Akalis at Anandpur Sahib which (Parkash Singh) Badal described as the past, present and future of Punjab. Dhillon narrates another incident of October 1, 1984 when 200 extremists gathered in the Golden Temple and made seditious speeches.we later found out that this was the work of the Akali faction close to Zail Singh. He is equally harsh on Arjun Singh who was the Governor of Punjab during the Presidents rule. Before Arjun Singh arrived in March 1985, we were doing fairly well with militant violence amrkedly under control. The former DGP then goes on to elaborate the hand of the Centre in managing Punjab through Arjun Singh who got installed S S Barnala as the chief minister in September 1985. As it happened, Arjun Singh had a hand in selecting candidates for the legislative elections, both for Congress and the Akali parties..It had to be ensured that the selection of Akali candidates was made in such a way that Barnala, and not Badal, would emerge as the leader of Akalis since Arjun Singh found the former easier to manage. Source - http://freepressjournal.in/dubious-game-by-zail-buta-alleges-former-cop/

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH Excellent advice from Baba Hardev Singh Looloval this weekend and something to remember for all of us: "Why must we always do nindya of other faiths and their holy men? If we spent as much time doing ustat of Sikhi instead of nindya of other faiths and their holy men, we would be much more respected. There is a saying in Punjab, if you want to get respect for your father in the pind, you have to respect other peoples' fathers."

When a Turkish man attempted to assassinate Pope John Paul II, the pope went to jail to meet him personally, forgave him and got him pardoned by the Italian president. Thats forgiveness Khima.

I think its very difficult if you're different from the rest of society around, but I think the same goes for other people too that are different in whatever way, like the disabled, or people who are unmarried in our culture and a lot of this is due to the worries about what others think. In my own family, my dad left and that was considered shameful for our family and so we were looked down on - in our society most difference is looked down on - that's why I find the message of our gurus so beautiful - everyone is equal before Waheguruji's eyes. Whatever others feel about you being homosexual, in the end its between you and Waheguruji, and I know that Waheguruji is the only one that accepts all. You said you're worried about your actions reflecting badly on sikhi, but there are many people drinking. swearing and doing worse in a pagg and dhari, at least you care enough about sikhi, but don't let others opinions come between you and Waheguruji. I used to feel very guilty and unworthy of Waheguruji as I felt I was not a good enough Sikh, but over time I realised it is between me and Waheguruji and not up to anyone else, no -one is perfect in this world. I think you should ask Waheguruji what to do and not let other's opinions distance you from him.

Come on guys - inject a little bit of rationality into this discussion. All I can see is a baby crying our making the kind of sounds that babies make. Indeed, one could equally argue that many new born babies utter the words wahh (guru)!!. For me the people who have an urge to sensationalise such things are weak in their faith. For them extraordinary events of 'miracles seem to be the basis of belief. The most important miracle and amazing about this video is not the baby making a sound but the very fact of its birth.

Is that supposed to be a joke? You can't put any metal in microwaves ! I've never tried putting them in a dishwasher, but should be ok.

I don't know why you are even posting on here ? If you have made up your mind and want to be on 'the other bus'', then go ahead, fair play, but DON"T mix your sexuality with sikhi. Being Gay or not doesn't have anything to do with sikhi. Sikhi is about gurmat conduct. This gurmat can be conducted whether you are gay or straight, white or black, jat farmer or churha, abled or disabled, rich or poor.....etc....etc.........

This happens to many people but what I would suggest you is to keep faith in our gurus. Never ever be afraid of such superstitious stuff. The day you are scared of them is the day you become victim. Always be proud to say that you are sikh and you have firm belief in sikhi and guru sahib jee protects you will keep bad stuff away. However your sikhi proudness should come from heart.

If possible, please try to find your friend. I have some pics for them, please make sure to send these and get the blackest magic done... Does this person charge? What are the charges per picture? And what is the guarantee that maximum damage will be caused? I promise to send more pics once we see results. We can then work out deals where you will get order in bulk and can give Sikhsangat members a flat rate discount as well perhaps? Thanks!

Any updates on the videos

i'm so glad you made this point before I did...i've never understood why Guru Ji cannot be translated if it was already done under the command of Dasveh Paathsha Ji. before everyone does interject i think if the ruling from Akal Takht is not to then fine, but I think the translations and phonetic translations ought to be made. I know that had they not have been, I would never have learned paath and probably wouldn't care about sikhi today. I believe the translated versions should be in Gutkeh or Sehnchiya but not the embodiment of Guru Ji and people ought to treat them with infinate respect but bow only to the one true Guru. I feel that many of the worlds problems could be solved and also think that if sikhi is to survive it must expand. people who would otherwise never have heard the words of our Guru ought to be afforded the same opportunities as we have been.