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Something to think about for Upcoming Southall Nagar Kirtan.

Wow you've lived a long time and my my what a long memory you've got...hahaha As long as man has existed,so his ego has caused him to attempt leadership of his equal man. After Baba Bahadur Singhs Khalsa raj, Ranjit Singh used considerable skill to unite a fractious 12 misls. The moment he was gone, the British were easily able to buy anyone to do their bidding for them...and have left that legacy for anyone else to utilise ever since. Of course the committee system is a remnant of our colonised past but...even in the panj pyaraa system, there is division and ego, don't kid yourselves there's not.

Very good points veer ji. This reminds me of Sant Singh Ji Maskeen talking about nindya. Maskeen Ji stated that calling the stem of a plan a stem is not nindya. However, calling a flower a stem is nindya. Maskeen Ji stated that most Sikhs are unwilling or too afraid to call a stem a stem and some even go as far as calling a stem a flower. Maskeen Ji stated that if more people were willing to call a stem a stem, many injustices could potentially be stopped. :)

Those who say Khalsa can't even rule in the Gurdwara and fight over management, should know we are living at the peak of Kalyug and Kalyug will show its colours in true sense. There is no power in the Universe that can stop Sant Khalsa to rise once again as it did in the old days. Malesh Khalsa (the sikhi show-off clan) will soon see its end. There are signs now in the current affairs which indicate Khalsa Haleimi Raj is approaching very near. The Khalsa shall rule from east to west and will see no opponents. Raaj Karegaa Khalsaa, Aaki rahey na koyee. Savaa Laakh jab dhukhey paleetaa, Tabey Khaalsa udey Ast lo jeetaa.

The Sikh Festivals: Maghi Introduction MaghiMaghi is the occassion when Sikhs commemorate the sacrifice of forty Sikhs, who fought for Guru Gobind Singh Ji. Maghi, Makara Sankranti, the first day of the month of Magh. The eve of Maghi is the common Indian festival of Lohri when bonfires are lit in Hindu homes to greet the birth of sons in the families and alms are distributed. In the morning, people go out for an early-hour dip in nearby tanks. For Sikhs, Maghi means primarily the festival at Muktsar, a district town of the Punjab, in commemoration of the heroic fight of the Chali Mukte, literally, the Forty Liberated Ones, who laid down their lives warding off an attack by an imperial army marching in pursuit of Guru Gobind Singh. The action took place near a pool of water, Khidrane di Dhab, on 29 December 1705. The bodies were cremated the following day, the first of Magh (hence the name of the festival), which now falls usually on the 13th of January. Following the custom of the Sikhs to observe their anniversaries of happy and tragic events alike, Maghi is celebrated with end-to-end recital of the Guru Granth Sahib and religious divans in almost all gurdwaras. Significance The day of Maghi is observed to honour the heroic fight of the Chali Mukte, or the Forty Liberated Ones, who sacrificed their own lives defending an attack by the imperial army marching in pursuit of Guru Gobind Singh. The action took place near a pool of water, Khidrane di Dhab, on 29 December 1705. Celebration Sikhs celebrate the Maghi with an end to end recital of the holy Guru Granth Sahib and religious rituals in all the Sikh Gurudwaras. On the eve of Maghi falls the common Indian festival called the Lohri when bonfires are lighted in Hindu homes and alms are also distributed. . however The largest assembly, however, takes place at Muktsar (Punjab) where big fairs are organized and pilgrims take a holy dip in the sacred waters of sarovar and also visit several shrines. A mahala or big march of pilgrims from the main shrine to gurdwara Tibbi Sahib, sacred to Guru Gobind Singh, concludes the three-day celebration.

There is a difference between dogma and belief in an ultimate creator. As kids our belief in God is a very simplistic one, but when you read/listen to Gurbani or even read the Mool Mantar you realise our comprehension is so limited. Our belief in an ultimate creator is based from a Human experience ( can be quite egotistical/selfish in my opinion) what we can get from God. What makes Sikhi unique is that when I first tried to read Japji Sahib (in English) , you see things from Waheguru's point of view. What you realise is that Waheguru is talking to the whole universe, it completely blew my mind. An atheist should at least believe in the Universe and the Universe is also part of the Akal.

nah they are more aggressive and the deen and caliphate/triumph of the ummah is all ...same way they are cramming kids into backstreet madrassey despite lack of safety and monitoring of the adults teaching ... When Sikhs were in touch with their itihaas they encouraged their kids to be warriors , when they fell into maya's charms then they discouraged their kids from Sikhi let alone warrior-like character.

If you're honest enough with yourself to see this, then you must be able to come to a rational conclusion that you are nowhere near ready to be in an environment of temptation.

There are plenty of ex-Sikhs who possess knowledge of the Sikh Dharam, but who leave the faith regardless. Resorting to ^this^ tired platitude in the face of every apostasy trivializes people's experiences and suffering. This young man didn't cut his hair because he was some clown who thought it would help him get the girls - if he was, he wouldn't have decided to start posting on an atheist forum. It's clear that he couldn't reconcile his rationality with his faith, and he deserves to be taken seriously. It's not easy to be forced to give up something which has been the bedrock of your existence for 20 years. No, it is just another example of what happens when parents do not give any knowledge to their children about Sikhi. The children of these parents should start taking some responsibility for themselves. They're not being remotely-controlled by mum and dad, there is nothing stopping them from learning Bani or Itihaas for themselves, like a lot of us had to do. Unless you're a little kid there is no excuse for not knowing your Sikhi, whether you have Gursikh parents, irreligious parents or no parents.

Not heard the saying '2 mics are better than one'..hahaha

No Paji GuptSinghji, I'm not part of Basics of Sikhi, meri mat thori a, I'm not that intelligent to do what they do. I just like to put their videos on as it helps me to learn and think they may help others too. I don't put on all of them, only relevant ones as to what's going on at the forum. I just sometimes go the extra step of finding them and this Chandigarh one came up on my fb. I'm copy paste wali ?

No, it is just another example of what happens when parents do not give any knowledge to their children about Sikhi. How can parents try their best when they themselves know very less about their own religion.

Agreed.. This mentality is still rife amongst Sikhs. They fail to understand the sant/sipahi, miri piri balance after equally add important.There is complete neglect of physical fitness and martial training from the life style of most modern day Sikhs. The kirpan has been demoted from a shastar to a symbolic piece of clothing. Some people think it's ok to just wear a little kirpan on a necklace instead. 'There was talk of such a science of archery and stick fighting only a few years ago in the Punjab that listening of it the English-educated young men will consider it astonishing. In sincerity I believe present day young men might just consider these skills and Shastar Vidiya most likely impossible, because they have not even seen those bows nevermind stringing them. Like this, many sciences and skills after attaining their heights have declined. Before 1857 many quivers full of arrows, matchlocks, flintlock guns, swords, lances, spears, Sang, Katar, Pesh Kabz, pistols, shields etc., weapons, armour and many types of chainmail was found house to house, and all the people in their homes learned and taught Shastar Vidiya and became complete soldiers. Now no one even speaks of these skills the sons of brave warriors are becoming engrossed in making money, even to us who have employed Shastar Vidiya, it is becoming a dream. In another fifty years or so, this Vidiya would have dried up and people will say it (past skills) were but, all lies' ('Twarikh Guru Khalsa', Giani Gian Singh Nirmala (1899) Vol.1, Pa. 36-37)

Khalsa is pure sovereign independent body from all these committees conflict. So quite bluntly and with all due respect, where are actual singhs who do honorable panj pyares di seva? Sangat should demand answers from them, what is actually their role when it comes to solving this kinda of conflict? or their overall role and responsibility? Let them define it, ask them for framework. They should following foot steps of orginal panj pyares not take their roles lightly or part time position. Again, Are they only there for part time symbolic gestures in nagar kirtan and amrit sanchar? If thats case, its quite contrary to historical duties of original panj pyares. I strongly believe - most of issues will get resolved if singhs who do panj pyares di seva actual maintain full time seva/leadership role for their local communities not just go back to their normal duties as soon as they are done becoming symbolic gestures.

Veer Ji, From my limited encounters with these types of people, it seems they have marital problems or other family problems where no one respects their authority at home so they seek power at the Gurdwara to exhaust their power. It's sad. May Waheguru protect the sanctity of our gurdwaras.

In recent months this is the second such fight I have witnessed. This time with Keshdhari's who introduced, santhia. ithaas classes and gatka over the past 2 years and mainly monay on the other side (who allegedly did the opposite or were not interested). In this situation if what Sukhdeep Singh is saying is true, then the old committee should not have taken to the stage and this bibi should have used her budhi not to disturb Guru Darbar in progress. If she wanted to make a point should have waited until after Sukhasan. What is it about taking control of a Gurdwarey with Sikhs? When run properly and where money is not squandered on white elephants and personal gain/status, it is a challenge and entails great responsibility to the Guru and the Sangat! ਸਿਰੀਰਾਗੁ ਮਹਲਾ ੧ ॥ ਸੁੰਞੀ ਦੇਹ ਡਰਾਵਣੀ ਜਾ ਜੀਉ ਵਿਚਹੁ ਜਾਇ ॥ The empty body is dreadful, when the soul goes out from within. ਭਾਹਿ ਬਲੰਦੀ ਵਿਝਵੀ ਧੂਉ ਨ ਨਿਕਸਿਓ ਕਾਇ ॥ The burning fire of life is extinguished, and the smoke of the breath no longer emerges. ਪੰਚੇ ਰੁੰਨੇ ਦੁਖਿ ਭਰੇ ਬਿਨਸੇ ਦੂਜੈ ਭਾਇ ॥੧॥ The five relatives (the senses) weep and wail painfully, and waste away through the love of duality. ||1|| ਮੂੜੇ ਰਾਮੁ ਜਪਹੁ ਗੁਣ ਸਾਰਿ ॥ You fool: chant the Name of the Lord, and preserve your virtue. ਹਉਮੈ ਮਮਤਾ ਮੋਹਣੀ ਸਭ ਮੁਠੀ ਅਹੰਕਾਰਿ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ Egotism and possessiveness are very enticing; egotistical pride has plundered everyone. ||1||Pause||

Is this just another example of what happens when families compel their children to keep kesh despite the adult children not really having any religious feelings? Parents have to try their best obviously, but as adults, it's a persons choice. Better this than a person putting on a sham throughout their adult life to please people, despite having no internalised belief. That's when you get dastaar wearing people secretly drinking, smoking and whatnot.

link veer ji

Thanks veer ji , I have been listening to different katha, vichaar vids from different nihangs and jathey and this just reminded me so much of those rehitnamey with brahmin soch pushed in...such as Singhni should do sewa of her SIngh (would do anyway) because he is her parmeshwar ....Mum and Dad had a bit of banter on that one ... (him: see you should listen me ...she: when you your akkal jud come in let me know LOL) ...point is SIkh marriage is a beautiful, happy, peaceful , supportive thing when done in its true sense but people keep wanting to drag our mentalities backwards into Hindu mat. I like Sukhwinder Singh Nihang , he reminds me of my bazurg very straightforward, no axe to grind against any one and explains very cleanly linking back to Guru Granth sahib ji

is it me or it look like a bunch of monay on one side and amritdhari's on the other... who are the two groups? is the former sponsored by indian gov?

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH The voice is of "Nihung Dharam Singh" - was declared tankhiya for his "parchar" previously: http://panthic.org/articles/5433 It doesn't sound like he understands what man and woman is in relation to Gurbani. Guru Sahib has stated over and over that the only true Husband/man is Akaal Purakh and we, humans, are the wives/women. Using this relationship, Gurbani explains how our relationship should develop with our Husband Lord. To make a direct translation in the manner of the speaker is not correct. I would not rely on this individual, any of his videos or the Youtube channel to provide any guidance towards Sikhi.

Who is the speaker penji? I haven't listened to it fully yet, but the statements above don't seem to be in line with what I have learned from Gurbani. What if a woman is not married or widowed? Seems like the statements are only applying to married women. My views will probably be similar to yours penji.

We need more of such street parchar in punjab.Sikh community is lost here in pakhand .the younger generation cannot correlate with the religion because nobody is there to tell the significance of Our religion .had we inculcate the values and virtues taught in our religion we would have created a happy peaceful world here but unfortunately even in 21st century our world is full of crimes and we are doing those crimes intentionally or unintentionally. I believe the western world is lucky as people there communite a lot cause of easy access to web.here in India nobody is there to direct and lead the young generation.I wish someone like Jagraj Singh comes here and form an Indian version of Basics of Sikhi.that 's the only way of saving our religion.I wonder why even in so many years we are not able to create a world based on values and virtues and I find that we focus more on just reading and showing others that we go to GUrudwara sahib so we are following Sikhism however the need of the hour is to understand the teachings of our Gurus to understand the meaning of every Bani that we recite.I wish more people look into this matter and contribute towards this.

I don't think it is, as they have their name as Sangat Matrimonial, and they would advertise this on their fb or website which it's not. But not sure if they are linked though.

Oh yessss lol. Oh dear, you are right, I wondered why their work stated around India and was thinking have they changed things. I put the wrong link on. Never fear, new link is here: http://www.sikhcouncilbirmingham.org/the-council.html Thank you ji for pointing that out, I thought it didn't look right when I put it on. Sorry ji not been concentrating lately.

We had them way way way back. Read Bhangu's Panth Prakash and he details fights over Gurdwara control and funds between Tat Khalsa and Bandai Khalsa in the early 1700s.

https://youtu.be/GJfAYhHNocg