That Turd Umar Is Back Trying To Bash Sikhism

[UKGupt Kaur]

Veer ji Bilja Singh, a moorakh(fool) like me for one has learned alot from your post's (in this thread and others).

In the midst of argument amongst ourselves here due to outside anti-Sikh propoganda agenda, this thread has brought out Gurmat Vichaar on Gurbani.

Your comments actually made me look up and think even more on how Gurbani should be learned and understood. Amongst otherthings, it highlighted to me the more then one interpretation of gurbani words and how to carefully read the whole shabad to understand how a specific word in question is interpreted. I have also downloaded the mahan kosh pdf that you mentioned. Very useful information you have brought forward.

Keep up the good work and dont let fools like me put you off. I hope there will be more Gurmat Vichaar done on this site.

If there werent turds like umar around, we wont have all the extremely useful article's published by project naad or searchsikhism !

This will be my last post since pal doesn't seem to understand anything. I only provided word to word meanings of the first half line as the second half is clear but I don't think he gets it. So here it is:

ਬੇਦ ਕਤੇਬ ਕਹਹੁ ਮਤ ਝੂਠੇ ਝੂਠਾ ਜੋ ਨ ਬਿਚਾਰੈ ॥

ਬੇਦਕਤੇਬ – Vedas and Quran

ਕਹਹੁ -I (Kabeer) say

ਮਤ - Religions

ਝੂਠੇ – false

ਝੂਠਾ - false is he

ਜੋ ਨ - who doesn't

ਬਿਚਾਰੈ - do vichaar of this fact

I (Kabeer) openly say that religions (ways) preached by Vedas and Quran are false and false are those who do not do vichaar or understand this fact.

Some scholars believe that the line means: "Do not call vedas and quran false without any vichaar." Either way both mean the same. Even after doing vichaar, one can reach the conclusion that vedas are false and teach how to sacrifice animals and human during havans. Mannu Simartee talks about how to torture and kill untouchables.

WHERE IN THE ABOVE SHABAD DOES IT SAY THAT....... THE SHABAD SAYS THAT VEDAS SIMARTIS AND PURANAS ARE SAYING OUT LOUD(PUKARAN) THAT WITHOUT NAM NEHEE CHUTKARA

Read the entire shabad first. Whatever hindu books are saying out loud is all hocha and koor. They do not have naam which is why at the end of the Shabad Guru Sahib asks Waheguru for naam. Otherwise, he would've stated that He has found naam in vedas. If you believe that:

VEDAS SIMARTIS AND PURANAS ARE SAYING OUT LOUD(PUKARAN) THAT WITHOUT NAM NEHEE CHUTKARA

Then provide me with a reference to hindu texts. Which hindu text is saying this? Give me the page number also.

OFF COURSE I AGREE WITH YOU THAT GURUS REJECTED VEDAS ETC

Then clearly false was rejected by Guru Sahib. If vedas and puranas were true then why did Guru Sahib reject them?

I think you should read Prof. Sahib Singh's meanings first, then Bhai Veer Singh's and then listen to audios of Sant Gurbachan Singh Ji. Bhai Kahan Singh and Bhai Randhir Singh also provide good meanings. Don't derive interpretations from your own mat and propagate vedas which are rejected in Sikhi. Study Islam and you will see how much garbage there is in Quran. Making up stuff about them would be wrong but highlighting what is written in those scriptures is not slandering them but exposing the truth. Use your energy to counter RSS and Muslims to defend Sikhi instead of fighting me. Believe in whatever you want. I simply wrote what I have learned. Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

[PAL 07]

oh how amazing that after so many of my posts you realized that you wasn't including this part

ਜੋ ਨ - who doesn't ....... in your explanation of the kabeer shabad..and so now you have decided to adulterate this pangtee ਬਿਚਾਰੈ - does vichaar of this fact you have written

ਬੇਦਕਤੇਬ – Vedas and Quran

ਕਹਹੁ -I (Kabeer) say

ਮਤ - Religions

ਝੂਠੇ – false

ਝੂਠਾ - false is he

ਜੋ ਨ - who doesn't

ਬਿਚਾਰੈ - do vichaar of this fact

but again you interpretation is wrong......... ਕਹਹੁ - should have been kaho mat chuteh then your arth would have been correct as in kaho nanak sab teri vadiayee.........but the shabad is written in maharaj as kahoho which doesn't mean kabeer because it is bahobachan.......its hard to write down what i am trying to say.........kahoho means what people are saying.........if it was ikbachan then it would have been kaho mat chute.... the transliteration is actually "o people dont call the veda, quran, bible,and torah as false,false is he who doesn't contemplate them"........as a gurbani santhia student the DDT samparday arth are as i have just given......the word Katebh actualy means the religious books of christianity,islam and judaism but you wouldn;t know this because you haven't done santhiya...........the word mat means dont.......as in mat bhole re man chet hari " o man don't forget vaheguruu but always try to think of him"...........your interpretation is only correct if the words were

ਬੇਦਕਤੇਬ – Vedas and Quran

ਕਹਹੁ -I (Kabeer) say

ਮਤ - Religions

ਝੂਠੇ – false

ਝੂਠਾ - false is he

ਜੋ - who

ਬਿਚਾਰੈ - does vichaar of this fact.........but notice the one letter missing NA

infact the arth are :-

ਬੇਦਕਤੇਬ – VED, QURAN, BIBLE, TORAH

ਕਹਹੁ - PEOPLE

ਮਤ - DONT CALL

ਝੂਠੇ – FALSE

ਝੂਠਾ - FALSE

ਜੋ WHOEVER

ਨ - DOESN'T

ਬਿਚਾਰੈ -CONTEMPLATE

" I.M ONLY WATCHING TO SEE WHAT CONTINOUS BULL*X*X YOU KEEP POSTING ONLY SO THAT I CAN EXPOSE TO THE REST OF THE MEMBERS THAT YOU ARE NOT A GYAANI BECAUSE I'VE POSTED SANT GURBACHAN SINGH JI'S KATHA OF CHAREH VED HOE SACHIARE AND YOUV'E STATED THAT IT MUST BE FALSE WHICH IS HARD TO BELIEVE... AND NOW IVE GOT HOLD OF THE KATHA BY SANT JI OF ANG 1350 OF THIS SHABAD AND I WANT TO SEE WHAT YOU SAY NOW.......

KATHA BY SANT JI COMING IN ABOUT HALF AN HOUR FROM THIS POST.........VJKKHALSAVJKF

[PAL 07]

GURFATEH,

HERE IT IS SANT GURBACHAN SINGH JI KHALSA VIDYA MARTAND PANTH RATTA PORAN BREHMGIANI MAHAPURSH DOING KATHA ON BED KATEBH KAHO MAT CHUTEH .......NOTICE HOW SANT ALSO PROVIDES A UTHANIKA (HOW IT HAPPENED IN KABEERS LIFE)

http://www.4shared.com/dir/2592350/3674aff/sharing.html

[N30S1NGH]

good post pal bhaaji !

[PAL 07]

ALSO BIJLA SINGH IS WRONG ABOUT THE OTHER GURBANI SHABAD I REFERED TO WHICH IS IN BAVAN AKHRI AS SASA SHASTAR SIMRIT VED PUKARE

http://www.4shared.com/dir/2592350/3674aff/sharing.html

MY REQUEST TO GURMUKH SIKHS IS THAT WE DONOT BEND GURBANI BACKWARDS FOR OUR OWN SELFISH AGENDAS AND DONT USE BIBLE BASHING AS A WAY OF DEALING WITH STRATEGIC THREATS FROM CERTAIN INDIVIDUALS WHATEVER THERE BELIEFS OR AGENDAS ARE.....

[chatrik]

boring!

[ocelot]

Sat Sri Akal,

All vedas are false.

So here we starts.

1)Vedas openly advocates Caste system, it states that if a shuder reads any Vedas boiling lead should be Put into his Ears. So it clearly advocates Caste system which is completely rejected in Sikh religion.

2)Vedas contains highly obscene and pornographic material, do you want me to give link to you?

It is fundamental principle of sikhi to fight kaam.

3)All vedas contains mythology, Have you read vedas, Do you really think that entire universe can be flooded with water.

4)Vedas advocate unsocial relations.

So dont just use bani use your Brains too.

Just do vichaar on evrything and see is it logical or not, and does it violate other banis.

Regards

[sikh supreme]

Sat Sri Akal,

All vedas are false.

So here we starts.

1)Vedas openly advocates Caste system, it states that if a shuder reads any Vedas boiling lead should be Put into his Ears. So it clearly advocates Caste system which is completely rejected in Sikh religion.

2)Vedas contains highly obscene and pornographic material, do you want me to give link to you?

It is fundamental principle of sikhi to fight kaam.

3)All vedas contains mythology, Have you read vedas, Do you really think that entire universe can be flooded with water.

4)Vedas advocate unsocial relations.

So dont just use bani use your Brains too.

Just do vichaar on evrything and see is it logical or not, and does it violate other banis.

Regards

Well said..

If anyone who follows of 100% what is said in either quran. vedas, bible,etc they would be following falsehood because clearly gurbani rejects majority of the teachings in them.

Some Sikhs are so niave they follow the word of so called "sants" then use their own akhal, their own mind/brain to interpret and see what is being said by gurbani in context.

[sikh supreme]

Anyways lets get back to the topic at hand of sorting out umer pathetic websites telling lies about Sikhism plus its stories of fake converts.