Jagraj Singh Responds To Muslims @ Hyde Park Corner

[InderjitS]

[Ranjeet01]

I think Jagraj Singh really enjoys these debates even though it can be very difficult for him to get a word in edgewise.

I do not know why everything with Muslims is about proving and disproving, it's like being in a law court providing evidence.

God is beyond this type of thinking and can completely understand when Jagraj Singh says that from a Sikh's point of view the muslim thought process on this matter is very limiting.

[sikhni777]

He is such a knowledgable person and admirable too. I am starting to wonder why he even bothers to talk to the muslims. Where are our own youngsters who should be crowding around him to listen and question Sikhism and try to understand better.

Its a shame on us that the preacher of our religion is having to go through this because of us. We are not interested in our own religion. Our religion is being preached to people who dont even believe and just want to keep interrupting and putting him down.

Religion is not supposed to be a discussion between whether Islam or sikhism is the correct religion. I firmly believe that he should be available for Sikh youngsters. Sikh religion is all about practicing.

In our Guradwara, when we are having the word of the Guru being preached, we sit down and listen quietly. That is the only way that it will be able to go into our minds and make a difference to our souls. We are being put into doubts on our own religion when we are having to listen to questions which the muslims keep posing.

I think these muslims are being totally disrespectful and this should be looked into. Our preacher should be preaching to Sikhs and being treated with great respect. He is preaching the name of God - not going out to sell something.

Well those are my own thoughts. Its not in my hands at the end of the day - it may be God's will.

[dallysingh101]

I think these muslims are being totally disrespectful and this should be looked into. Our preacher should be preaching to Sikhs and being treated with great respect. He is preaching the name of God - not going out to sell something.

I think some people need to wake up to the fact that dealing with other people from other faiths (actually some people within will do it too), involves a contest of sorts - and challenges. This cannot always be done in a polite, civil manner.

This is especially true of Islam which likes to try and throw a burden on others to provide 'evidence' that their faith is correct (but often can't sustain their own religion using their own lines of reasoning, when applied to their own history/faith).

People being 'disrespectful' isn't against the law - but another tactic to appear superior and stronger than your adversary.

We are being put into doubts on our own religion when we are having to listen to questions which the muslims keep posing.

That's the whole point. If watching this stuff makes you personally doubt things, don't watch it. Thing is Muslims have tried and tested methods of dawa that involve psychology to a high degree. People who aren't strong minded are susceptible to such parchaar.

[Akalifauj]

I think Jugraj Singh should brush up on Gurbani that speaks about Muslims and their Prophet to be more effective with his arguments. I have seen a couple of his videos preaching outside and its mostly Muslims arguing against him. Many shabads from Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji have the answers for these Muslims questions. If he can't memorize the Shabads. He can bring a print out with him to help recall certain Shabads to provide a better answer. At the end of the day it is not about winning or losing, but about presenting Sikhi in the manner Guru Sahib gave Sikhi to us.

Funniest part was when the Muslim said, Is God in the toilet? LOL Ironically, in that moment I would have said your mind is filthier than the toilet, so should I refrain from saying God is in your mind? God is infused in everything giving it support and existence. If God is not in something, then it doesn't exist. In that moment the Muslim is probably picturing a old man with a white beard and a Muslim head cover sitting in the toilet saying, "watch where you poo I just washed up in here, I'm watching you!!!!!" lmao

[13Mirch]

I think some people need to wake up to the fact that dealing with other people from other faiths (actually some people within will do it too), involves a contest of sorts - and challenges. This cannot always be done in a polite, civil manner.

This is especially true of Islam which likes to try and throw a burden on others to provide 'evidence' that their faith is correct (but often can't sustain their own religion using their own lines of reasoning, when applied to their own history/faith).

People being 'disrespectful' isn't against the law - but another tactic to appear superior and stronger than your adversary.

That's the whole point. If watching this stuff makes you personally doubt things, don't watch it. Thing is Muslims have tried and tested methods of dawa that involve psychology to a high degree. People who aren't strong minded are susceptible to such parchaar.

To digress slightly:

In his multi-volume retelling of the fanatic Aurangzeb's life, and actions, Sir Jadhunath Sarkar makes some very candid and substantiated remarks about the concept of an Islamic state:

"By the theory of it's origin the Muslim state is a theocracy... In such a state, infidelity is logically equivalent to treason... Therefore, the toleration of any sect outside the fold of Orthodox (it is imperative to note here "orthodox") Islam is no better than compounding with sin... The conversion of the entire population to Islam and the extinction of every form of dissent is the ideal of the Muslim state."

- Sarkar, "History of Aurangzeb," vol. III, pg. 248-250.

According to the Koran, "the only faith acceptable to Allah is Islam."

-3:19.

Given the radical impetus of the Prophet's faith in gaining more "reverts" is it any wonder then that:

"A non-Muslim, therefore, cannot be a citizen of the state; he is a member of a depressed class; his status is a modified form of slavery."

-Sarkar, pg. 251.

In a mockery of the plight of the enslaved Hindus, many orthodox Muslims under Aurangzeb's reign would taunt:

"No other religious authority except the great Imam (Hanifa) whose faith we follow, has sanctioned the imposition of the "Jizzya" on Hindus. According to all other theologians, the rule for Hindus is 'either death or Islam...'"

-Sarkar, pg. 252.

Given this incendiary tendency, it was inevitable that both Sikhi and Islam would clash. Akbar's tolerance was effaced by his rebellious, and alcoholic, son Jahangir. An avid fan of Sheikh Ahmad Sirhindi and the latter's revival of Islamic fundamentalism (yes, it existed even back then), the drunkard would comment:

"He (Sirhindi) has made the revival of (Islamic) orthodoxy something of a movement."

-Tuzuk-i-Jahangiri quoted in Mujib, M: "The Indian Muslims."

Guru Nanak Dev Ji had rejected Islam in all it's forms. Disabusing many Muslims of their elitist notions he would proclaim:

"Make kindness thy mosque, sincerity thy carpet of prayer; what is just thy Koran; modesty thy circumcision; civility thy fasting and so shalt thou be considered a true Muslim."

- AGGS Ang. 140.

This was directly a challenge to Islam and it's elitism. Dismissed was the mosque, dismissed were the five prayers and the necessities of circumcision, dismissed was the Koran in it's stead a new and more humane formula was created.

Such tenets, and their practicalities, soon earned the Sikhs the ire of the Islamic clergy. Whilst being tortured Guru Arjan Dev Ji is said to have elucidated:

"I bear all this torture to set an example...The true test of faith is in the hour of misery. Without examples to guide, ordinary persons' minds quail in the midst of suffering. In the second place, if he who possesseth power within him, defends not his religion by the open profession thereof the man who possess no such powers will, when put to the torture abjure his faith. The sin will light on the head of him who hath the power but showeth it not and God will deem him an enemy of religion."

-Macauliffe, pg. 94-95.

The Guru's open "profession" of his faith and it's principles of challenging tyranny head on were the reasons behind his execution by the "Islamic state."

What is ironic is that the Guru had the last word against his executioners:

"Whatever I possess I spend on the poor, the friendless and the alien. If thou require money than take from me however much you desire; but if thou demand a fine than I will not render you even a single penny! And as to thy edicts demanding censor of certain hymns from the sacred Granth Sahib, nor will I alter nor erase even a single passage. I am a worshiper of the Immortal God, the Supreme Soul of the world. There is no monarch to save him!"

-Macauliffe, vol. III, pg. 100.

This was a direct attack against the theocratic foundations of the Mughal-Islamic state. The Guru happily accepted death for expressing "dissent" or otherwise practicing and preaching a faith deviant from the Prophet's. The question now is that does the "peaceful" variant of Islam presented by Westernized Muslims hold any credence in light of the faith's own doxa? Are we blindly going to kowtow to their cliched lines, "religion of peace etc etc" whilst their radicals continually massacre us? As Sikhs it is our duty to challenge radical Muslims, wherever they be and whoever they be, as prioritized by our noble and steadfast Gurus.

[Jonny101]

Thing about the Dawa guys is that while others are there to listen and learn something new but the dawa guys are there to argue and disprove their opponents which they try to do with Bhai Jagraj Singh but fail to do everytime. Even Godless atheists were on the side of Jagraj Singh.

These salafist dawa types try to act very "logical" using your own scripture against you. They do this with Christians everytime. At first Christians had no answer to this since they did not know much about Quran Hadiths or about Prophet Muhammad. But now they are catching up with people like David Wood who beats Muslims in debates including scholars like Shabir Ally.

[Guest Jacfsing2]

I dislike the comparison of Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji and Jesus when we say our Gurus Sahib's were God. Jesus made people worship in his name; while Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji made people worship in the name Vaheguru, (though jaapong Dhan Guru Nanak by itself can be beneficial), we are not the same!

[FriendlyStranger]

I dislike the comparison of Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji and Jesus when we say our Gurus Sahib's were God. Jesus made people worship in his name; while Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji made people worship in the name Vaheguru, (though jaapong Dhan Guru Nanak by itself can be beneficial), we are not the same!

This is from the bible, Romans 10:10-18:

“the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, 13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Not trying to say that Jesus is equal to Dhan Dhan Guru Nanak Dev Ji, but Christianity has some great things to say. The only thing that saddens me is that they still think all non-Christians are going to hell.

[13Mirch]

Thing about the Dawa guys is that while others are there to listen and learn something new but the dawa guys are there to argue and disprove their opponents which they try to do with Bhai Jagraj Singh but fail to do everytime. Even Godless atheists were on the side of Jagraj Singh.

These salafist dawa types try to act very "logical" using your own scripture against you. They do this with Christians everytime. At first Christians had no answer to this since they did not know much about Quran Hadiths or about Prophet Muhammad. But now they are catching up with people like David Wood who beats Muslims in debates including scholars like Shabir Ally.

Either you can tolerate them or either you can strike at their ideology and wipe them out.