Hukam vs Not-Hukam

[Jai Tegang!]

Perhaps there is Vaheguru’s Hukam that regulates EVERYTHING in all of creation, and within this Hukam  there is Satguru’s Hukam in the form of Gurbani ,Gurithihaas, Anubhav Gian, that is meant for guiding lives of Gursikhs.

Perhaps Hukam can be understood differently according to our own avastha. For those still living in duality, there is free will, while those who are merged will see all as predetermined Hukam.

For example, there is “ everything that happens is in His Hukam”. This to me feels like the overarching Akaal Purakh Vaheguru’s Hukam that runs the whole show.

Then you have “It is Guru Ji’s Hukam that we rise early and meditate on His Name”.

You also get “Guru sahib sent a Hukam for the sangat of Kabul for such and such actions”. Which seems like a time specific Hukam(order).

With this differentiation, I suppose we are all in Vaheguru’s Hukam regardless of our actions, while having a choice to follow Guru’s Hukam for a Gursikh life.

 

 

[Shaheed4life]

4 hours ago, Akalifauj said:

So these things happen outside of Hukam?  

Disclaimer: please don't be scared of the question.

Vaheguru ji ka khalsa Vaheguru ji ki fateh 

Hanji veerji bad crimes happen out of Hukam most of the time except for some cases.For example in the autobiography of Bhai Sahib Bhai Randhir Singh ji, Bhai Sahib mentioned that in his previous life he was a prince and one day when he went to a cave he saw a very old person meditating.I can't remember the exact story now but basically what happened is Bhai sahib tried to put food in the meditating guy's mouth and ended up breaking one of that guys teeth.In return the meditating person came out of his meditation and got angry as he was disturbed and took a weapon and aimed it at Bhai Sahib but it ended up in Bhai Sahib's bodyguard's leg.So in next life the bodyguard took Janam again and shot the Meditating Guy who also took Janam again.He shot him in the leg as well.So these kinda of things are more of Hukam as they are more of Hisab. Where it has to be balanced.

Hope I helped 

Bhul Chuk Maf

[GurjantGnostic]

[Shaheed4life]

12 minutes ago, Jai Tegang! said:

Perhaps there is Vaheguru’s Hukam that regulates EVERYTHING in all of creation, and within this Hukam  there is Satguru’s Hukam in the form of Gurbani ,Gurithihaas, Anubhav Gian, that is meant for guiding lives of Gursikhs.

Perhaps Hukam can be understood differently according to our own avastha. For those still living in duality, there is free will, while those who are merged will see all as predetermined Hukam.

For example, there is “ everything that happens is in His Hukam”. This to me feels like the overarching Akaal Purakh Vaheguru’s Hukam that runs the whole show.

Then you have “It is Guru Ji’s Hukam that we rise early and meditate on His Name”.

You also get “Guru sahib sent a Hukam for the sangat of Kabul for such and such actions”. Which seems like a time specific Hukam(order).

With this differentiation, I suppose we are all in Vaheguru’s Hukam regardless of our actions, while having a choice to follow Guru’s Hukam for a Gursikh life.

 

 

Hanji that is true too.That we can only go to Gurudwara Sahib or wake up in the early hours during Amritvela Sahib by Hukam.However, it is our choice if we want to go to  Gurudwara Sahib and end up talking to others or if we go to Gurudwara Sahib and learn something so that we can apply it in our daily lives.

Bhul Chuk Maf

[brotha]

12 hours ago, Shaheed4life said:

If I'm not wrong Hukam is the following things

When we are supposed to be born

Where we are supposed to be born 

How long we are supposed to live

Who our family is

Everyone we meet in our life as we have some Lehna Dehna with them.

What we are supposed to eat

Where we are supposed to travel.

How we are supposed to die

And more things like that.

Brother Saheed4life,

all that you describe above, could not it well be a result of our on karam?

Because if that was the Hukum (partiality to have more or less), it would be much unfair towards those who have sufferings or pain or etc, just because of His Hukum.

That would be seen as unfair from His side if it was so, but thank god, it is not.

Of course. our karam, our destiny, is a law, which is  executed under His hukum, which means, as does one sow, so does one reap, and not because He wants to  favor you or disgrace you, for above everything He is an infinite Ocean of love and mercy.

In that respect Gurbani tells us:  

ਹੁਕਮਿ ਰਜਾਈ ਚਲਣਾ ਨਾਨਕ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਨਾਲਿ ॥੧॥

Hukam Rajaaee Chalanaa Naanak Likhiaa Naal ||1||

हुकमि रजाई चलणा नानक लिखिआ नालि ॥१॥

O Nanak, it is written that you shall obey the Hukam of His Command, and walk in the Way of His Will.

So, as seen above, if we obey the hukum of His command and walk the way of His will, which is being vitous, and of throughly cleansing ourselves with the Amrit of His Nam, then, we shall not incurr in any karmas for which we would have to keep on rolling in the wheel of 84.

We are all foreigners in this land of untruth, or we could say, we are guests in His this creation house , so we should be careful to not harm or misbehave anybody with word, speech or thought, for then we shall be incurring in karmas for which we will undoubtedly have to come back and settle.

In another verse, Guru Jee tells us :

ਹੁਕਮੀ ਉਤਮੁ ਨੀਚੁ ਹੁਕਮਿ ਲਿਖਿ ਦੁਖ ਸੁਖ ਪਾਈਅਹਿ ॥

Hukamee Outham Neech Hukam Likh Dhukh Sukh Paaeeahi ||

हुकमी उतमु नीचु हुकमि लिखि दुख सुख पाईअहि ॥

By His Command, some are high and some are low; by His Written Command, pain and pleasure are obtained.

Though it is clear in this verse above,  but His command for us means, the law of karma, our own sown seeds, and for which, we get pain, pleasure, and any such thing with which we encounter or have in our lives.

Everything created by Him, is subject to natural and perfect laws, such as law of gravity, law of karmas, etc.  It is only that we fail to realize His command as such, for we are lost in haume, anyhow, His hukum is infinite just as His greatness,  so we can never ever decribe it .

Sat Sree Akal.

 

 

[Akalifauj]

4 hours ago, Shaheed4life said:

Vaheguru ji ka khalsa Vaheguru ji ki fateh 

Hanji veerji bad crimes happen out of Hukam most of the time except for some cases.

Gurbani says 

ਲਿਵ ਧਾਤੁ ਦੁਇ ਰਾਹ ਹੈ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਕਾਰ ਕਮਾਇ ॥

(ਉਸ ਵਿਚਾਰੇ ਉਤੇ ਭੀ ਕੀਹ ਰੋਸ ? (ਸੰਸਾਰ ਵਿਚ) ਰਸਤੇ ਹੀ ਦੋ ਹਨ (ਹਰੀ ਨਾਲ) ਪਿਆਰ ਤੇ (ਮਾਇਆ ਨਾਲ) ਪਿਆਰ; (ਤੇ ਮਨਮੁਖ) ਪ੍ਰਭੂ ਦੇ ਹੁਕਮ ਵਿਚ (ਹੀ) (ਮਾਇਆ ਵਾਲੀ) ਕਾਰ ਪਿਆ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ 
Loving attention to the Lord and attachment to Maya are the two separate ways; all act according to the Hukam of the Lord's Command.

Guru Amar Daas Ji in Siree Raag - 87

[Akalifauj]

ਹੁਕਮੀ ਸਭੇ ਊਪਜਹਿ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਕਾਰ ਕਮਾਹਿ ॥

(ਮਾਇਆ ਦੇ ਮੋਹ ਦੇ ਜਾਲ ਵਿਚੋਂ ਨਿਕਲਣਾ ਜੀਵਾਂ ਦੇ ਵੱਸ ਦੀ ਗੱਲ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੈ) ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਦੇ ਹੁਕਮ ਵਿਚ ਸਾਰੇ ਜੀਵ ਪੈਦਾ ਹੁੰਦੇ ਹਨ, ਉਸ ਦੇ ਹੁਕਮ ਵਿਚ ਹੀ ਕਾਰ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਨ 
By the Hukam of His Command, all are created. By His Command, actions are performed.

ਹੁਕਮੀ ਕਾਲੈ ਵਸਿ ਹੈ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਸਾਚਿ ਸਮਾਹਿ ॥

ਪ੍ਰਭੂ ਦੇ ਹੁਕਮ ਵਿਚ ਹੀ ਸ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਟੀ ਮੌਤ ਦੇ ਡਰ ਦੇ ਅਧੀਨ ਹੈ, ਹੁਕਮ ਅਨੁਸਾਰ ਹੀ ਜੀਵ ਸਦਾ-ਥਿਰ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ ਦੀ ਯਾਦ ਵਿਚ ਟਿਕਦੇ ਹਨ 
By His Command, all are subject to death; by His Command, they merge in Truth.

ਨਾਨਕ ਜੋ ਤਿਸੁ ਭਾਵੈ ਸੋ ਥੀਐ ਇਨਾ ਜੰਤਾ ਵਸਿ ਕਿਛੁ ਨਾਹਿ ॥੮॥੪॥

 ਹੇ ਨਾਨਕ ! ਉਹੀ ਕੁਝ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ ਜੋ ਉਸ ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਨੂੰ ਚੰਗਾ ਲੱਗਦਾ ਹੈ, ਇਹਨਾਂ ਜੀਵਾਂ ਦੇ ਵੱਸ ਵਿਚ ਕੁਝ ਨਹੀਂ ।੮।੪।
O Nanak, whatever pleases His Will comes to pass. Nothing is in the hands of these beings. ||8||4||

Guru Nanak Dev Ji in Siree Raag - 55

[Shaheed4life]

4 hours ago, brotha said:

Brother Saheed4life,

all that you describe above, could not it well be a result of our on karam?

Because if that was the Hukum (partiality to have more or less), it would be much unfair towards those who have sufferings or pain or etc, just because of His Hukum.

That would be seen as unfair from His side if it was so, but thank god, it is not.

Of course. our karam, our destiny, is a law, which is  executed under His hukum, which means, as does one sow, so does one reap, and not because He wants to  favor you or disgrace you, for above everything He is an infinite Ocean of love and mercy.

In that respect Gurbani tells us:  

ਹੁਕਮਿ ਰਜਾਈ ਚਲਣਾ ਨਾਨਕ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਨਾਲਿ ॥੧॥

Hukam Rajaaee Chalanaa Naanak Likhiaa Naal ||1||

हुकमि रजाई चलणा नानक लिखिआ नालि ॥१॥

O Nanak, it is written that you shall obey the Hukam of His Command, and walk in the Way of His Will.

So, as seen above, if we obey the hukum of His command and walk the way of His will, which is being vitous, and of throughly cleansing ourselves with the Amrit of His Nam, then, we shall not incurr in any karmas for which we would have to keep on rolling in the wheel of 84.

We are all foreigners in this land of untruth, or we could say, we are guests in His this creation house , so we should be careful to not harm or misbehave anybody with word, speech or thought, for then we shall be incurring in karmas for which we will undoubtedly have to come back and settle.

In another verse, Guru Jee tells us :

ਹੁਕਮੀ ਉਤਮੁ ਨੀਚੁ ਹੁਕਮਿ ਲਿਖਿ ਦੁਖ ਸੁਖ ਪਾਈਅਹਿ ॥

Hukamee Outham Neech Hukam Likh Dhukh Sukh Paaeeahi ||

हुकमी उतमु नीचु हुकमि लिखि दुख सुख पाईअहि ॥

By His Command, some are high and some are low; by His Written Command, pain and pleasure are obtained.

Though it is clear in this verse above,  but His command for us means, the law of karma, our own sown seeds, and for which, we get pain, pleasure, and any such thing with which we encounter or have in our lives.

Everything created by Him, is subject to natural and perfect laws, such as law of gravity, law of karmas, etc.  It is only that we fail to realize His command as such, for we are lost in haume, anyhow, His hukum is infinite just as His greatness,  so we can never ever decribe it .

Sat Sree Akal.

 

 

What I meant by Hukam is also based on karam.Its similar to what you said.Let me give an example if a person insults someone who is handicapped and does bad things to him then it is in Hukam that the mean person should be born as a handicapped person.

Bhul Chuk Maf

[Shaheed4life]

48 minutes ago, Akalifauj said:

Gurbani says 

ਲਿਵ ਧਾਤੁ ਦੁਇ ਰਾਹ ਹੈ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਕਾਰ ਕਮਾਇ ॥

(ਉਸ ਵਿਚਾਰੇ ਉਤੇ ਭੀ ਕੀਹ ਰੋਸ ? (ਸੰਸਾਰ ਵਿਚ) ਰਸਤੇ ਹੀ ਦੋ ਹਨ (ਹਰੀ ਨਾਲ) ਪਿਆਰ ਤੇ (ਮਾਇਆ ਨਾਲ) ਪਿਆਰ; (ਤੇ ਮਨਮੁਖ) ਪ੍ਰਭੂ ਦੇ ਹੁਕਮ ਵਿਚ (ਹੀ) (ਮਾਇਆ ਵਾਲੀ) ਕਾਰ ਪਿਆ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ 
Loving attention to the Lord and attachment to Maya are the two separate ways; all act according to the Hukam of the Lord's Command.

Guru Amar Daas Ji in Siree Raag - 87

Thank you for the amazing Shabad veerji.I will think more of this.

Bhul Chuk Maf

[1Anonymous1]

What I’ve learnt is that nothing is out of hukam. Even our ardaas, we may think we are doing the ardaas for more bhajan bandgi, but it is maharaj doing kirpa on us so we can get close to him, he’s making us do the ardaas. Vaheguru. 

I personally think we have no choice at all, no power, everything is out of our control, even if we think we are doing it. 

I remember a couple of years ago at amritvela while doing naam simran, I fell asleep and had a dream where I didn’t wake up at amritvela. I saw this as meaning nothing is out of hukam, everything is written, even my nitnem. I forgot about the dream and remembered a couple days later when I didn’t wake up at amritvela. I had dreamt the exact  same colour of keski, clothes i was wearing and even someone beeping the horn really loud outside at the exact same moment. When I woke up, I immediately said “dhan guru Nanak, menu maaf kardo, naam di daat bakhshdo. Then I realised it’s exactly what I said in the dream. That car beeping the horn could have been someone almost being in an accident, it was already written for that person that he would have a near miss accident, i had seen it 3 days ago. Everything is hukam. 

I’m not saying this so people think i have an amazing avastha and I can see the future, I have a low jeevan, but it’s just one kirpa maharaj had done on daas to understand hukam. Maharaj could have made me remember the dream and so I would have known to be vigilant and wake up that day. But I didn’t, I forgot it, only remembered after it happened. This explained hukam to me. It was in my karam, that day I was going to miss amritvela.

Everything is happening in the will of ik... everything is ik. If those that are doing simran are saying it’s only happening because of hukam, then why can’t the person sinning be happening in hukam as well? It works both ways.