Gay Marriages

[Saihajleen Kaur Khalsa]

Article on Homosexuality by Yuktanand Singh:

Gurbani deals mostly with our psychological and spiritual life. The fact that an issue concerns the body, like Sex, and exercise, does not make it imperative for the Gurus to have taught us about it. They taught us to treat our body with respect. We should take care of it as the temple of our soul, who is very dear to God. It is the image of God himself. They taught that we use all our sense organs responsibly, and preserve the energy wasted through passions, especially sex and anger.

Many ideas discussed below make me admire how the Gurus required the Sikhs to be married and have children. According to Gurbani, it is assumed that a spiritual Sikh is chaste except for procreation. However, common Sikhs are not prohibited from enjoying a healthy physical relationship within the marriage.

It is also wrong to assume that just because some behavior is prevalent, like birth control, or perversion, the Gurus should have addressed it, or that we need to develop a statement about it, like the pope does. The same is true of homosexuality. Just as, Gurbani or the Reht-Maryada manuals do not describe how Siamese twins should walk, approach the Guru, bow, sit in the Sangat, eat in the Pangat, get married, etc. Does this mean that the Gurus were deficient in covering all the issues of our life?

The Gurus give us the wisdom to examine the facts and develop the correct course of action in all such situations. Let us briefly examine homosexuality. Again, these are my personal views. I know I am going to offend someone with some politically incorrect statements again. I just want to share my views as a fuel (in this case) fo

r thought.

Homosexuality is an aberration. No one knows what causes it. Most homosexuals are born that way. Usually, they do not have a choice. It is not "acquired." There are unproven theories that molestation of children, at a young age can confuse them about their sexuality. Perhaps S Pritam Singh can make a better use of his expertise and shed some light on this. It can not be a "sin," to be homosexual, per se, because, as far as I know, people do not choose to be this way out of their free will.

However, acting it out is a separate matter of debate. The Gurus do not address it because this is not an issue in the relationship between man, or woman, and God. Thus, it is left up to us to develop our own response to such questions, in view of the facts in the light of Guru's teaching. Some day, if for some reason, people continue to ask these questions, the Sikh spiritual leaders may need to have a Gurmatta (A unanimous decision, which matches Guru's ideals) on this subject. However, engaging in such a decision may be viewed as disgraceful for the spiritual Sikhs, for reasons I have already discussed above.

The mere facts that this condition is congenital, prevalent world wide, hedonistic to people suffering with it, incurable, and that it does not compromise a person's cognitive faculty, does not qualify it to be called as an "alternative lifestyle." Because we know, that this lifestyle is not conducive to a healthy society. Before anyone argues, can you picture a civilization consisting of only homosexuals and lesbians? How long will it last? This is one reason that some religions have called it a "sin."

Even if we can not comprehend the spiritual damage it causes, the act itself, is not natural. Not to mention that, for some reason, it also promotes promiscuity. We have reached today's state of human development through natural selection. Homosexual people, quite clearly, could not survive natural selection. If you place strict homosexuals and lesbians on an island

by themselves, they will be extinct within the same generation, because of the lack of procreation. Except, they do not become extinct in the heterosexual world, because this is not a hereditary trait.

Personally, my only problem in dealing with homosexuality is that they are generally promiscuous and many flaunt their preferences in public, especially since the new liberal attitude. We do not wear T-shirts or special jewelry to proclaim we are heterosexual! Why do they? Some of it could be the "rebound phenomenon" because of recent liberal attitude in society. Another point to ponder, people who spend all their time planning and procuring their next partner for the weekend, does their preference for the opposite gender make any difference? Does it make them any better than those who prefer the same gender?

This topic is taking me too long. I am starting to feel nauseous. Really. May be it was something I ate. Perhaps we should not discuss this on a full stomach.

It seems that in the old times, the society, and people with this condition were as confused as they are today. But they were also ashamed of their condition. Often, this led them to make a better use of their life than spend their life chasing the opposite (or same) sex. We see that many great artists and spiritual writers were homosexual. As <admin-profanity filter activated> said, we do not know how big a role homosexuality played in turning men into monks. Perhaps, the same could be said about nuns, and many others who never married. As a rule, there is always some good, waiting to emerge, as a result of our afflictions.

Of course, we should never generalize. Many great Hindu sannyasi like, Swami Vivekananda, were never married, and were not homosexual.

Q. How should a homosexual person view himself?

A. A child of God, like everyone else, who happens to have come across some "bad Karma," resulting in jumbling up of the neurons, pleasure centers, and gender identity. It is wrong to condemn yourself for s

omething that is out of your control. Just like, some are born without limbs, or eyes. It is not a sin to be blind! Why should it be a sin to be homosexual? Make the best of your life starting from who you are. At the same time, it is also wrong to force others to accept you as a perfectly normal individual.

Q. How should the society, or the family, treat them?

A. Same as you would treat someone who is physically disabled, is depressed, is alcoholic, or has a seizure disorder, etc. They should be treated with compassion, according to their ability to live sensibly and perform their function in society, not judged by their private life, which they should keep to themselves.

The experts in this field best handle many of their social and psychological problems. Parents should be aware of this and seek expert help early, during childhood or adolescence. However, be on the guard so that these "experts" do not teach your child the "New Morality." Do not try to "cure" or "exorcise" them. Do everything to ensure that you continue an open communication with your child. It is not your mistake if your child is homosexual.

Do not be ashamed of them either. Do not teach your child to "hide" it. At the same time, I never understood why hiding, or flaunting, your <admin-profanity filter activated> preference should be an issue. People do not do so in a normal and decent society. If the homosexual people want to be treated as others, they should behave like the others do.

Q. Should they be allowed to recite Guru Granth Sahib?

A. Personal life should not be a problem if a person is clean, decent and his/her behavior is not dominated by their <admin-profanity filter activated> preference. This would apply to heterosexuals too. Additionally, if we do not know the private life of someone, how can we dictate anyone's activity, especially in the privacy of one's home?

I would not knowingly appoint such a person as a priest. A sincere Sikh would himself/herself refrain fr

om accepting such a position. There will always be exceptions, made in case of exceptional people. The mere fact that someone wants to be appointed a priest to assert "equal rights" would prove that this person lacks humility, and thus, does not deserve to be appointed to such a position!

Q. Can they be "married" in a Gurudwara?

A. This is not possible. The Sikh marriage is only between man and a woman, or humans and God. The Gurus recognize no other marriage.

Q. Did God create the homosexuals?

A. God created everything.

We are forced to discuss some issues due to the modern promiscuity and a trend to sanitize and justify aberrant behavior. These are my views in light of what the Gurus teach us. If I left some question unanswered please ask it. Please correct me wherever I am wrong.

[JSingh]

Very enlightening article by Yuktanand Singh Ji. Thanks for posting it Sehajleen Kaur Ji. As he said, a Sikh marriage is between a man and woman and between humans and God, therefore, homosexuals cannot marry in the Gurdwara. But at the same time, if someone is a homosexual, we should not have any problem either cuz our Guru's faught and sacrificed their lives for the rights of others.

bhul chuk di khima...

[Cali_Khalsa]

WJKK, WJKF:

I’ve been lurking here for the past few days, and I gotta say I’m pretty saddened to read some of the comments that have been posted here. Regardless of how one may view the topic of homosexuality and whether you believe one is or isn’t born one, we should at the very least refrain from making degrading remarks about them. We are all free to disagree, but these are human beings we are talking about and not some heathenistic creatures of the night that some would like to portray them as. This forum should not be a conduit which somehow legitimizes or condones gay bashing.

The question that was asked was how does Sikhism view homosexuality? Clearly, this was not an issue that was directly addressed by our Guru’s, but one can make a logical inference that they believed that marriage should be between a man and a woman. That does not mean however, that anyone who falls outside of these parameters should be discriminated or ridiculed by society. Our religion preaches tolerance first and foremost and we are consistently reminded in Gurbani to refrain from passing judgments on others. Yet, that is exactly what some have engaged in here.

Regardless of my own personal views about homosexuality, I will however add that I do not believe that any nation should pass laws that prevent them from being treated equally under the law. Presently in the United States, the current policy is one that is akin to the Jim Crow Laws that existed during the mid 20th century. The Supreme Court said that "separate but unequa

l" did not make it equal when it ruled that segregation was unconstitutional in 1954.

I believe that gay couples should be afforded all the legal rights and protections that would be afforded to heterosexual couples. I do not believe the Constitution of the United States should be amended in any way shape or form to legitimize discrimination against an entire segment of our society. If and when the Constitution is modified, it should be done to grant more rights to its people, not take them away! We are a secular nation, and neither the Bible nor any other religious text for that matter should dictate the outcome in this matter.

I should also like to add that I have friends who are gay and have gone to school and worked with them. I can assure you that they are not the "kaam crazy" beings that some have incorrectly portrayed them as. If you have questions about their motivations and desires, you should have a good heart to heart conversation with them and get their perspective. I think you will see that they are anything but. That is an absurd argument because heterosexual unions also involve an element of kaam as well. You guys swear that having ANY <admin-profanity filter activated> feelings or pleasure is "bad"…I pity that you would deprive yourselves of such a wonderful emotion that God has blessed us with. For a Sikh, we are only told that we should keep from becoming overtly attached or totally consumed by this...

Who people choose to experience this pleasure with, regardless of gender, is nobody’s business but that person alone (including Rosie O’Donell et.al.). Far be it from me to pass my moral beliefs onto an entire society. Worry about your damn selves people before sitting here on your pedestals lookin’ from above. There are lot more pressing issues in this day and age than who people are going to bed and spending their lives with!

-Gurfateh

[GABROO KHALISTAN DAH]

gays will never have my respect what ever they do...

they should not be given marriage rites...as marriage is union of man and woman....dont take marriage away from the common couple

gays over all SUCK

Admin Note: Gabroo Jee, your first 2 sentences in this post are examples of opinions that are allowed on this forum, the last sentence... 'gays over all SUCK' is an example of an opinion that we would rather not have on this forum. Please be more sensitive to the opinions and lifestyles of others; even when they happen to be wrong. -7

sure

[Cali_Khalsa]

WJKK, WJKF:

"GABROO KHALISTAN DAH,"

Ordinarily, I would not dignify your homophobic and un-Sikh like comments with a reply whomever you may be.

I will only say that no child of Guru Gobind Singh Ji would ever dare to harbor the hatred that is evidently rampant in your soul. Guru Sahib has taught me to love ALL. I pray that one day you will realize the divine message that they have all given us to help us in our daily lives including that of love and tolerance.

I humbly request that the moderators refrain from allowing similar posts in the future as they serve no purpose other than to incite hate and animosity towards our fellow human beings. Please enforce your own rules:

"Stereotyping of any culture, religion, race, or group of people is not allowed!"

-Gurfateh

[GABROO KHALISTAN DAH]

thnx for dignifying it

[Sunny]

gays will never have my respect what ever they do...

they should not be given marriage rites...as marriage is union of man and woman....dont take marriage away from the common couple

gays over all SUCK

Admin Note:  Gabroo Jee, your first 2 sentences in this post are examples of opinions that are allowed on this forum, the last sentence... 'gays over all SUCK' is an example of an opinion that we would rather not have on this forum.  Please be more sensitive to the opinions and lifestyles of others; even when they happen to be wrong. -7

sure

lol! my my .. how wierd the moderators can be .. I've had posts that were deleted or moved and nothing happens with an obvious outrageous post.

Anywho, I am with Cali Singh on this one. Our Guru ji's taught us to LOVE all. On that note..

For all you people who play down gay people.. only God can judge a person. We have more important issues to deal with in society.

- Sunny

[DhadiMania]

sikhs tolerate all things, so gabrro ji, for a son of guru gobind singh, i think wot u sed woz wrong.

[Guest SikhForLife]

read old thread

Gays and Lesbians within Sikhism

http://forums.waheguroo.com/index.ppa?act=ST&f=2&t=158

[S1ngh]

I have many gay friends.. But does that mean i hate em? do i look them as low? NO ! Sikhs never supposed to hate anyone ! the one who don't like em : You hate them, not your sikh dharam.. Represent yourself, not ur whole community that's my input..

And see old thread link given by