GURUDWARA RULES NEED TO BE ENFORCED.

[Surrey Singh]

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

There has been something on my mind for quite some time now. And i think we need to take action. It is in regards to Gurudwara etiquette. From what i have seen in some Gurudwaras, there seems to be a very relaxed mood when it comes to enforcing basic Maryada and rules. Here is a list of some things that i feel we need to enforce immediately...

1) No talking in the Darbar. --- The Darbar is a place for Sangat to listen to Gurbani, not to listen to people talking about there lives. I have seen so often (sorry to say, especially on the female side) people siting in groups just chatting it up, not listening to Kirtan themselves, and distracting others from enjoying the Kirtan. This is disrespectful to Guru Ji, if you want to talk, just leave.

what should be done? --- we should make it OUR personal duty to inform anyone talking in the Darbar Hall to please be quiet, and also talk to the Gurudwra committee to regularly announce the importance of silence in the Darbar. Don't be afraid that someone may get mad at you, it is our DUTY to enforce respect of Guru Ji.

2) Controlling Children --- for many people a Gurudwara is like a playground for children. I know it is natural for a kid to enjoy playing with other kids, but there is a time and place for everything, and playing in the Darbar is not appropriate.

what should be done?--- Any kid running, yelling, and making a disturbance in the Darbar should be dealt with right away. Go straight to the parent(s), and explain that the child's behaviour is disturbing Sangat who wants to focus, and if the kid can

39;t be controlled, then the parent should take the kid out of Darbar hall. I especially feel for my sisters, you are trying to listen to kirtan, but having to 'tune out' the kids who are yelling and rolling around. It is our duty to enforce Maryada instead of just hoping the problwm will eventually go away. Another idea: have Paraydars on duty strictly for enforcing silence during diwans.

3) Langar Maryada --- In some Gurudwaras i have been to, i see many little kids doing seva in the Langar. I love to see children get involved in Seva, but they must follow the rules. Most of them are just too young to know about rules, keeping Langar sucha etc...for example, not washing their hands, touching the karchi to the plate, touching water container to the glass, serving wth uncovered hair. These kid's parents must not have explained to them how to serve langar, and may think it is not a big deal, but it is a HUGE deal. There are many Amritdharis who want to be jooth free, but may be getting served by a karchi which touched the jootha food of a smoker. Just two days ago i asked a kid who was serving langar if he washed his hands, and he said "yes, i did at home". I can guarantee that at the local gurudwra i go to, there are many kids who go to the washroom, play on the ground, eat etc...and then just start serving langar without washing hands because they "already washed them once when they came to the Gurudwara. I have even sen a kid a walking around serving jalaybees and eating them while serving. These little kids don't know the rules, it is upto us to teach them.

what should be done?--- talk to the committee and have people on duty to enforce Langar soocham. Educate the kids, ask them if they washed their hands with soap, make announcements on stage to tell people about the rules, and tell parents to tell their kids, make flyers with rules etc. If we don't do anything about this, then it is partly OUR fault that the langar being served is not sucha.

There are m

any other things that occur in the Gurudawara that must be controlled. I'm not coming out here to complain, i am coming out here to share my views and to ask the Sangat to make a difference in our Gurudwaras. I know there are many Gurudwaras that are keeping the rules enforced, and that is really good, but some Gurudwaras are slacking. If anyone has any information/advice etc...please post! Lets try to make Gurudwara a place where we can sit in the Darbar, and listen to Gurbani without any distractions, have sucha Langar etc...because it will benefit EVERYONE and as Sikhs we don't turn our head the other way when there is a problem, or expect someone else to do it, we take action and do it ourselves, especially where respect of Guru Ji and Sangat is involved.

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[simmal tree]

Thanks for your message Bhai Sahib.

I am really inspired by your enthusiasm and dedication.

I hope that we can all take a responsible role in this.

do you think putting signs up would help?

what other things could we do? your ideas are great.

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

[Singh132]

This is an interesting topic. Before I decided to keep bibek, I had stopped eating at langars because I saw how some sevadaars touched karchhees to plates and made things joothaa.

The solution is to follow the puraatan maryada: langar was never an "open" seva. Special trained sevaadaars were the ones who did this seva and doing this, no such problems arose. No matter how many signs you put up and not matter what you do, there are always going to be people who don't care and just grab a jug of water and start to serve with unclean hands or touching glasses. Langar was always controlled by special sevaadaars and should continue like this.

[DhadiMania]

rreally gud points. but 1 thing

gud luck tryin 2 enforce all this. i cn ppl tryin 2 do wot ure doin, but ppl carry on with woteva they do. but wen i c kids messin about, i'll try n stop em. once i saw this kid kickin the bricks nr the enterance of the gurdwara, i wuz gonna shout, but then i thought the gyanis were gonna do summat, they jus walked str8 past. nxt time i his gran, i'll tell her (the kids only 9 i think),

[simmal tree]

Now that I think of it, I somewhat agree with the Singh's post about closed seva.

I disagree with completely closed seva - I think if people want to do seva and they have pyaar and they are willing to co-operate with the maryada, then they should be allowed.

However there should be some security clearance. Some people have told me about instances where "pairadaars" stood in front of the langar too. So I agree with this although this is a verrrrry difficult and long process.

I think signs and discussions is the starting point. . . but I'm not sure still. . .

if somebody has any key solutions / instructions please share with the sangat and maybe we can try them out.

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

[S1ngh]

How should we do this?? Most of the gurdwara managment ppls are not that easy going who will listen to guy like me :umm: So how to take these steps?? any ideas.. shud i print them and hand it to them.. Or should i make a awareness flyer and put on the windshield of all gurdwara sahib visitors ? Any suggestions ??

[Gurjeet_Kaur]

Vaheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa Vaheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!!

gud luck tryin 2 enforce all this. i cn ppl tryin 2 do wot ure doin, but ppl carry on with woteva they do.

Even if people do carry on with whatever they do, we still need to try.

Signs are a good start, but soon they just become invisible and people forget all about them - so maybe if we had bright orange and green signs, people would pay attention :e:

But the gurdwaray definitely need to have discussions about soocham and respect in the darbaar. Most gurdwarey usually have a youth group or english katha or something, so that could be the medium.

i remember a few weeks ago i was at the gurdwara and there was some vaisakhi mela thing going on for little kids and they were giving out cotton candy... and this lady came into the darbaar with her kid holding a half eaten thing of cotton candy... and he continued to eat it while sitting..

[ms514]

Sat Sri Akal:

Just a cautionary story. A family friend told us this story from a Gurudwara. He was sitting in the sangat and trying to listen to Kirtan but this one kid kept running around and yelling. So he stopped the kid and told his dad (who was close by) to control his kid. The father got all upset and basically stated who are you to tell me what to do? The family friend explained that this was disrupting the sangat and that he should control his kid. This situation almost escalated to the both of them going outside for a round of boxing (luckily, it did not).

So I caution you...your intentions are good, but sometimes, people just don't have common sense and might take your suggestion as a personal attack (yes, some people are just that way).

Solution? There is one, but try to sell committees and the sangat this one. The Gurudwara could assign volunteers to Usher service, like in churches, and those who talk get a good talking to (basically Pehraedaars who maintain a level of silence in the Gurudwaras). This would include cell phones and those who have the supreme nerve of having a conversation on a cell phone INSIDE the Darbar Hall (I mean really, can you imagine a person doing something like this if Guru Nanak Sahib or Guru Gobind Singh Ji were conducting a Darbar?... :umm: ).

It is really a sad situation in many Gurudwaras. Almost everytime a Kathakaar is doing a Katha, he (sorry, no femals Kathakaars yet) has to stop midway and say "I humbly request that the congregation remain silent." It is downrigh

t embarassing and rude. This even happens in Gurudwaras in which a separate langar hall exists to where a person can easily go to if they want to chat.

[Guest noonespecial]

This topic has made me think about a situation that I recently saw at a Kirtan program.

Is it appropriate for the langar for men and women to be seperated? I'm not talking about the sangatees who are eating langar but I am talking about the langar that is being served. Is it appropriate for men and women to be served from seperate buckets? While at this kirtan program, the men's langar was placed on one table and the women's langar placed on another table. Furthermore, the sevadaars were not allowed to take the Langar off the ladies table to serve the men and vice versa. Basically, men could only be served from langar designated for men and women could only be served from buckets that were designated for women.

Although the langar was the same for both genders (ie. same daal and saabji) the serving of it was segregated. I believe this was done for the purpose of "organizing" langar but I felt that this could be wrong.

Could the Sangat please let me know what they think of this??? It would be really appreciated.

Thank you!

:e:

[Mkhalsa]

One that really gets me is violations of degh maryada.. Constantly degh is not made in sarbloh which is an accepted panthic maryada accepted by all jathas.

Another thing is people bring it from home!! Amritdharis and non amritdharis, who knows how they make it or in what, most of them dont even bother putting it in steel!