City "sikhs" & Malhi To Welcome Modi!

[JSinghnz]

Will this casteist backwardness of so called Sikhs ever stop?

[Kira]

It's highly amusing how people pull 1 line out of Gurbani and the and suddenly try use to justify their own needs and wants. If anyone's wondering the entire part of Bani that Jagsaw seems to enjoy butchering up and pasting one line from has an entirely different meaning when read within the context and by knowing the appropriate history behind it. In fact there's a Sakhi which addresses it all.

[JagsawSingh]

Will this casteist backwardness of so called Sikhs ever stop?

Are you asking your question / frustration towards Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji when HE says ਖਤ੍ਰੀਆ ਤ ਧਰਮੁ ਛੋਡਿਆ ਮਲੇਛ ਭਾਖਿਆ ਗਹੀ ॥ The K'shatriyas (khatris) have abandoned their religion, and have adopted a foreign language or are you aking youre question to the 300 million Pakistanis that became 'islamic' after seeing how the 'kohj' caste in Lahore that control 75% of the country's weatlh whilst having a culture of wine and fine parties are the brand new name of the brand new caste created by the Sikh and Hindu Khatris that wanted to hang on to their wealth in 1947 or......are you addressing your question to the Sikhs that like to forget how the mega big money mega industralist Sikhs of Lahore became 'khoj' Muslims rather than be Sikh and homeless or .........are you asking it to the Hindus that could add to their wealth during the Sikh Raj b making their eldest son a Sikh or.....are you addressing your question to their descendants that live in Bombay and Delhi and thus provide the Bollywood version of Sikhi whereby a Sikh is nothing more than a Hindu with a turban on his head doing pooja to some idol ?

Truth ? What does this mean to you as a Sikh?

Truth. It comes in many forms in many different cultures but it is always just simply the truth. Punjab is not the only creation of Waheguru. HE created the entire world. In the entire world there are a group of people that get rich on the back of the suffering of the masses. We, the masses spill our blood for them and their business intrerests. We, the unwashed masses, fight wars for them without knowing how it was all designed to protect their business interests.

Hard times that we Sikhs have known and experience. Do you think they have experience of it or have empathy of it ?

No. That is why 90% of th UK Sikhs welcoming Modi are these people. That is why 100% of the Queen's OBE and MBE honours for Sikhs for services towards Sikhs has gone to these people. My mother fighing fist to fist against facists, our grandfathers struggle in laying the foundation all means nothing. All mean nothing because royalty is here. All bow down down to royalty. They are so royal......so special.......so oh so fair and lovely that we can't even mention how they marry their chache's sons and daughters, massad's sone and daughters.......pooah's sons and daughters....i.e first cousins.

Can't mention anything.

Its an upside down world and Gurbani warned us about it.

The people that control the wealth are the true unouchbles. In this upside down world (maya) the suffering are not allowed to say anything about the 2% that control 90% of the wealth because they are unouchable.......unpeacable.....beyond criticism.

[Kira]

Are you asking your question / frustration towards Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji when HE says ਖਤ੍ਰੀਆ ਤ ਧਰਮੁ ਛੋਡਿਆ ਮਲੇਛ ਭਾਖਿਆ ਗਹੀ ॥ The K'shatriyas (khatris) have abandoned their religion, and have adopted a foreign language or are you aking youre question to the 300 million Pakistanis that became 'islamic' after seeing how the 'kohj' caste in Lahore that control 75% of the country's weatlh whilst having a culture of wine and fine parties are the brand new name of the brand new caste created by the Sikh and Hindu Khatris that wanted to hang on to their wealth in 1947 or..........are you asking it to the Hindus that could add to their wealth during the Sikh Raj b making their eldest son a Sikh or.....are you addressing your question to their descendants that live in Bombay and Delhi and thus provide the Bollywood version of Sikhi whereby a Sikh is nothing more than a Hindu with a turban on his head doing pooja to some idol ?

Truth ? What does this mean to you as a Sikh?

Please stop disrespecting Bani by pasting 1 line and then blowing into whatever you want it to be. That entire section is related back to a key event in Guru Nanak Dev Ji's udasi. The entire portion is related to Kalyug the Pandit. If you bothered reading the very next line you would know it's not attacking a certain caste but humanity as a whole for reducing themselves to the social status of sin.

For anyone wondering about that Sakhi, It's here.

http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Guru_Nanak_Dev_And_Kaljug_Pandit

The entire Shabad can be read here.

ਧਨਾਸਰੀ ਮਹਲਾ ੧ ਘਰੁ ੩

Dhhanaasaree Mehalaa 1 Ghar 3

धनासरी महला १ घरु ३

Dhanaasaree, First Mehl, Third House:

28818 ਪੰ. ੧੭

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ੴ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ॥

Ik Oankaar Sathigur Prasaadh ||

ੴ सतिगुर प्रसादि ॥

One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:

28819 ਪੰ. ੧੭

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ਕਾਲੁ ਨਾਹੀ ਜੋਗੁ ਨਾਹੀ ਨਾਹੀ ਸਤ ਕਾ ਢਬੁ ॥

Kaal Naahee Jog Naahee Naahee Sath Kaa Dtab ||

कालु नाही जोगु नाही नाही सत का ढबु ॥

No, no, this is not the time, when people know the way to Yoga and Truth.

28820 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੮

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਥਾਨਸਟ ਜਗ ਭਰਿਸਟ ਹੋਏ ਡੂਬਤਾ ਇਵ ਜਗੁ ॥੧॥

Thhaanasatt Jag Bharisatt Hoeae Ddoobathaa Eiv Jag ||1||

थानसट जग भरिसट होए डूबता इव जगु ॥१॥

The holy places of worship in the world are polluted, and so the world is drowning. ||1||

28821 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੮

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਕਲ ਮਹਿ ਰਾਮ ਨਾਮੁ ਸਾਰੁ ॥

Kal Mehi Raam Naam Saar ||

कल महि राम नामु सारु ॥

In this Dark Age of Kali Yuga, the Lord's Name is the most sublime.

28822 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੮

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਅਖੀ ਤ ਮੀਟਹਿ ਨਾਕ ਪਕੜਹਿ ਠਗਣ ਕਉ ਸੰਸਾਰੁ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

Akhee Th Meettehi Naak Pakarrehi Thagan Ko Sansaar ||1|| Rehaao ||

अखी त मीटहि नाक पकड़हि ठगण कउ संसारु ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥

Some people try to deceive the world by closing their eyes and holding their nostrils closed. ||1||Pause||

28823 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੯

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਆਂਟ ਸੇਤੀ ਨਾਕੁ ਪਕੜਹਿ ਸੂਝਤੇ ਤਿਨਿ ਲੋਅ ॥

Aaantt Saethee Naak Pakarrehi Soojhathae Thin Loa ||

आंट सेती नाकु पकड़हि सूझते तिनि लोअ ॥

They close off their nostrils with their fingers, and claim to see the three worlds.

28824 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੯

ਮਗਰ ਪਾਛੈ ਕਛੁ ਨ ਸੂਝੈ ਏਹੁ ਪਦਮੁ ਅਲੋਅ ॥੨॥

Magar Paashhai Kashh N Soojhai Eaehu Padham Aloa ||2||

मगर पाछै कछु न सूझै एहु पदमु अलोअ ॥२॥

But they cannot even see what is behind them. What a strange lotus pose this is! ||2||

28825 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੧

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਖਤ੍ਰੀਆ ਤ ਧਰਮੁ ਛੋਡਿਆ ਮਲੇਛ ਭਾਖਿਆ ਗਹੀ ॥

Khathreeaa Th Dhharam Shhoddiaa Malaeshh Bhaakhiaa Gehee ||

खत्रीआ त धरमु छोडिआ मलेछ भाखिआ गही ॥

The K'shatriyas have abandoned their religion, and have adopted a foreign language.

28826 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੧

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਸਭ ਇਕ ਵਰਨ ਹੋਈ ਧਰਮ ਕੀ ਗਤਿ ਰਹੀ ॥੩॥

Srisatt Sabh Eik Varan Hoee Dhharam Kee Gath Rehee ||3||

स्रिसटि सभ इक वरन होई धरम की गति रही ॥३॥

The whole world has been reduced to the same social status; the state of righteousness and Dharma has been lost. ||3||

28827 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੨

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਅਸਟ ਸਾਜ ਸਾਜਿ ਪੁਰਾਣ ਸੋਧਹਿ ਕਰਹਿ ਬੇਦ ਅਭਿਆਸੁ ॥

Asatt Saaj Saaj Puraan Sodhhehi Karehi Baedh Abhiaas ||

असट साज साजि पुराण सोधहि करहि बेद अभिआसु ॥

They analyze eight chapters of (Panini's grammar and the Puraanas. They study the Vedas,

28828 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੨

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਬਿਨੁ ਨਾਮ ਹਰਿ ਕੇ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਨਾਹੀ ਕਹੈ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਦਾਸੁ ॥੪॥੧॥੬॥੮॥

Bin Naam Har Kae Mukath Naahee Kehai Naanak Dhaas ||4||1||6||8||

बिनु नाम हरि के मुकति नाही कहै नानकु दासु ॥४॥१॥६॥८॥

But without the Lord's Name, no one is liberated; so says Nanak, the Lord's slave. ||4||1||6||8||

28829 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੩

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

After this Bani moves onto aarti.

It's far too easy to take one line out of bani and spin it to be something else. If you want to show respect to bani at-least read the external context. I'm not arguing about whatever frenzy you're worked up in. I just felt the need to point out that small fact.

[JagsawSingh]

Please stop disrespecting Bani by pasting 1 line and then blowing into whatever you want it to be. That entire section is related back to a key event in Guru Nanak Dev Ji's udasi. The entire portion is related to Kalyug the Pandit. If you bothered reading the very next line you would know it's not attacking a certain caste but humanity as a whole for reducing themselves to the social status of sin.

For anyone wondering about that Sakhi, It's here.

http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Guru_Nanak_Dev_And_Kaljug_Pandit

The entire Shabad can be read here.

ਧਨਾਸਰੀ ਮਹਲਾ ੧ ਘਰੁ ੩

Dhhanaasaree Mehalaa 1 Ghar 3

धनासरी महला १ घरु ३

Dhanaasaree, First Mehl, Third House:

28818 ਪੰ. ੧੭

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ੴ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ॥

Ik Oankaar Sathigur Prasaadh ||

ੴ सतिगुर प्रसादि ॥

One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:

28819 ਪੰ. ੧੭

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ਕਾਲੁ ਨਾਹੀ ਜੋਗੁ ਨਾਹੀ ਨਾਹੀ ਸਤ ਕਾ ਢਬੁ ॥

Kaal Naahee Jog Naahee Naahee Sath Kaa Dtab ||

कालु नाही जोगु नाही नाही सत का ढबु ॥

No, no, this is not the time, when people know the way to Yoga and Truth.

28820 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੮

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਥਾਨਸਟ ਜਗ ਭਰਿਸਟ ਹੋਏ ਡੂਬਤਾ ਇਵ ਜਗੁ ॥੧॥

Thhaanasatt Jag Bharisatt Hoeae Ddoobathaa Eiv Jag ||1||

थानसट जग भरिसट होए डूबता इव जगु ॥१॥

The holy places of worship in the world are polluted, and so the world is drowning. ||1||

28821 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੮

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਕਲ ਮਹਿ ਰਾਮ ਨਾਮੁ ਸਾਰੁ ॥

Kal Mehi Raam Naam Saar ||

कल महि राम नामु सारु ॥

In this Dark Age of Kali Yuga, the Lord's Name is the most sublime.

28822 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੮

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਅਖੀ ਤ ਮੀਟਹਿ ਨਾਕ ਪਕੜਹਿ ਠਗਣ ਕਉ ਸੰਸਾਰੁ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

Akhee Th Meettehi Naak Pakarrehi Thagan Ko Sansaar ||1|| Rehaao ||

अखी त मीटहि नाक पकड़हि ठगण कउ संसारु ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥

Some people try to deceive the world by closing their eyes and holding their nostrils closed. ||1||Pause||

28823 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੯

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਆਂਟ ਸੇਤੀ ਨਾਕੁ ਪਕੜਹਿ ਸੂਝਤੇ ਤਿਨਿ ਲੋਅ ॥

Aaantt Saethee Naak Pakarrehi Soojhathae Thin Loa ||

आंट सेती नाकु पकड़हि सूझते तिनि लोअ ॥

They close off their nostrils with their fingers, and claim to see the three worlds.

28824 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੯

ਮਗਰ ਪਾਛੈ ਕਛੁ ਨ ਸੂਝੈ ਏਹੁ ਪਦਮੁ ਅਲੋਅ ॥੨॥

Magar Paashhai Kashh N Soojhai Eaehu Padham Aloa ||2||

मगर पाछै कछु न सूझै एहु पदमु अलोअ ॥२॥

But they cannot even see what is behind them. What a strange lotus pose this is! ||2||

28825 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੧

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਖਤ੍ਰੀਆ ਤ ਧਰਮੁ ਛੋਡਿਆ ਮਲੇਛ ਭਾਖਿਆ ਗਹੀ ॥

Khathreeaa Th Dhharam Shhoddiaa Malaeshh Bhaakhiaa Gehee ||

खत्रीआ त धरमु छोडिआ मलेछ भाखिआ गही ॥

The K'shatriyas have abandoned their religion, and have adopted a foreign language.

28826 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੧

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਸਭ ਇਕ ਵਰਨ ਹੋਈ ਧਰਮ ਕੀ ਗਤਿ ਰਹੀ ॥੩॥

Srisatt Sabh Eik Varan Hoee Dhharam Kee Gath Rehee ||3||

स्रिसटि सभ इक वरन होई धरम की गति रही ॥३॥

The whole world has been reduced to the same social status; the state of righteousness and Dharma has been lost. ||3||

28827 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੨

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਅਸਟ ਸਾਜ ਸਾਜਿ ਪੁਰਾਣ ਸੋਧਹਿ ਕਰਹਿ ਬੇਦ ਅਭਿਆਸੁ ॥

Asatt Saaj Saaj Puraan Sodhhehi Karehi Baedh Abhiaas ||

असट साज साजि पुराण सोधहि करहि बेद अभिआसु ॥

They analyze eight chapters of (Panini's grammar and the Puraanas. They study the Vedas,

28828 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੨

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਬਿਨੁ ਨਾਮ ਹਰਿ ਕੇ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਨਾਹੀ ਕਹੈ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਦਾਸੁ ॥੪॥੧॥੬॥੮॥

Bin Naam Har Kae Mukath Naahee Kehai Naanak Dhaas ||4||1||6||8||

बिनु नाम हरि के मुकति नाही कहै नानकु दासु ॥४॥१॥६॥८॥

But without the Lord's Name, no one is liberated; so says Nanak, the Lord's slave. ||4||1||6||8||

28829 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੩

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

After this Bani moves onto aarti.

It's far too easy to take one line out of bani and spin it to be something else. If you want to show respect to bani at-least read the external context. I'm not arguing about whatever frenzy you're worked up in. I just felt the need to point out that small fact.

The Bani I quoted was a tiny 5% of what I said.

Frenzy ???

Define 'frenzy' , my friend. I'm feeling alot of things right now but 'frenzy' is about as far removed as one can get from these emotions.

[proactive]

Jagsaw and Proactive,

You say that these sellouts tend to be from one particular community? Your sample size is....the Sikh population of London, or lets say, England to be fair. Lets look at the larger sample size of...India.

You talk about the entire Sikh community being united. Yes they are - against a man and a particular family, from a particular caste. Are we allowed to mention it? You certainly haven't - despite mentioning the "2% group". Alright then, I will. Yes you guessed it - jatt! The Badal's aka the Dhillon's aka the mafia.

Whilst you're busy mentioning the Khatri's, you've failed to look at the bigger picture. Mr Dhillon has systematically attempted to finished off Sikhi in Punjab. He's not the only one from that community who attempted this. Remember KPS Gill, or Gen Brar? Which community were they from? Even if we look at Southall Singh Sabha, Mr Sohi (former pardhaan) has stated that he is proud to have finished off the Khalistan movement in the UK - why wasn't his caste mentioned when judging his loyalty?

My point isn't to denigrate the jatts. But, since you don't stop banging on about caste, unloyal Khatri's, etc etc, I feel have no other option but to mention it. It seems rather silly of you Jagsaw, to talk about a few Khatri businessmen who want to meet Modi, who have received OBE's, when, right under your nose, Mr Dhillon has ensured that Punjabi Sikhs are killed off at gunpoint, and those that survive are cancer-ridden, disease-ridden, unemployed, marginalised and read textbooks which teach the kids incorrect Sikh history - something he has not corrected. Mr Dhillon has put zero effort to ensure the release of Rajoana and other Sikh political prisoners. He has formed political coalitions with the BJP - need I say more! Not only has Mr Dhillon attempted to finished off Sikhi in Punjab for this generation. His legacy aka the daily cancer train in Malwa has ensured that the next generation of Sikhs will be so weak, there will be little attempt at another uprising. If anyone survives the above - then they want to commit suicide (farmers).

Mr Dhillon has built a business empire stretching from Punjab to Dubai to North America - off the backs of hard working punjabi's of all backgrounds. All the while the common man in Punjab is dodging uranium infested water/soil and dodging a bullet from the police for a peaceful protest. Suddenly, a Khatri businessman receiving an OBE doesn't sound as bad.

Under Mr Dhillon, life is so bleak, that if he and his government forces haven't killed you off, then you're going to want to top yourself off regardless. Unless you can escape to England.

My point, my dear friends, is simply to highlight that their are traitors in all communities/castes and no one single caste is better than the other in terms of loyalty or sacrifice for Sikhi. Even if we have been told otherwise by our parents.

I say this as a julaha. Neither jatt or Khatri - so no conflict of interest.

Our real enemies are watching us. All this jatt v khatri nonsense. They would like nothing more than seeing the Sikhs divided.

Don't give them an excuse.

We are discussing the sells out who are welcoming the mass murderer Modi and not Badal. This small set of people are available to the Indian govt whenever they require Sikh faces for their propaganda. These sell outs will attend any Indian govt function which any decent self respecting Sikh would think twice before attending.

[JSinghnz]

Are you asking your question / frustration towards Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji when HE says ਖਤ੍ਰੀਆ ਤ ਧਰਮੁ ਛੋਡਿਆ ਮਲੇਛ ਭਾਖਿਆ ਗਹੀ ॥ The K'shatriyas (khatris) have abandoned their religion, and have adopted a foreign language or are you aking youre question to the 300 million Pakistanis that became 'islamic' after seeing how the 'kohj' caste in Lahore that control 75% of the country's weatlh whilst having a culture of wine and fine parties are the brand new name of the brand new caste created by the Sikh and Hindu Khatris that wanted to hang on to their wealth in 1947 or......are you addressing your question to the Sikhs that like to forget how the mega big money mega industralist Sikhs of Lahore became 'khoj' Muslims rather than be Sikh and homeless or .........are you asking it to the Hindus that could add to their wealth during the Sikh Raj b making their eldest son a Sikh or.....are you addressing your question to their descendants that live in Bombay and Delhi and thus provide the Bollywood version of Sikhi whereby a Sikh is nothing more than a Hindu with a turban on his head doing pooja to some idol ?

Truth ? What does this mean to you as a Sikh?

Truth. It comes in many forms in many different cultures but it is always just simply the truth. Punjab is not the only creation of Waheguru. HE created the entire world. In the entire world there are a group of people that get rich on the back of the suffering of the masses. We, the masses spill our blood for them and their business intrerests. We, the unwashed masses, fight wars for them without knowing how it was all designed to protect their business interests.

Hard times that we Sikhs have known and experience. Do you think they have experience of it or have empathy of it ?

No. That is why 90% of th UK Sikhs welcoming Modi are these people. That is why 100% of the Queen's OBE and MBE honours for Sikhs for services towards Sikhs has gone to these people. My mother fighing fist to fist against facists, our grandfathers struggle in laying the foundation all means nothing. All mean nothing because royalty is here. All bow down down to royalty. They are so royal......so special.......so oh so fair and lovely that we can't even mention how they marry their chache's sons and daughters, massad's sone and daughters.......pooah's sons and daughters....i.e first cousins.

Can't mention anything.

Its an upside down world and Gurbani warned us about it.

The people that control the wealth are the true unouchbles. In this upside down world (maya) the suffering are not allowed to say anything about the 2% that control 90% of the wealth because they are unouchable.......unpeacable.....beyond criticism.

Only so called Sikhs like you can be so mentally stufffed that they can think about frustrated about Guru Granth Sahib.

[Guest Jacfsing2]

Please stop disrespecting Bani by pasting 1 line and then blowing into whatever you want it to be. That entire section is related back to a key event in Guru Nanak Dev Ji's udasi. The entire portion is related to Kalyug the Pandit. If you bothered reading the very next line you would know it's not attacking a certain caste but humanity as a whole for reducing themselves to the social status of sin.

For anyone wondering about that Sakhi, It's here.

http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Guru_Nanak_Dev_And_Kaljug_Pandit

The entire Shabad can be read here.

ਧਨਾਸਰੀ ਮਹਲਾ ੧ ਘਰੁ ੩

Dhhanaasaree Mehalaa 1 Ghar 3

धनासरी महला १ घरु ३

Dhanaasaree, First Mehl, Third House:

28818 ਪੰ. ੧੭

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ੴ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ॥

Ik Oankaar Sathigur Prasaadh ||

ੴ सतिगुर प्रसादि ॥

One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:

28819 ਪੰ. ੧੭

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ਕਾਲੁ ਨਾਹੀ ਜੋਗੁ ਨਾਹੀ ਨਾਹੀ ਸਤ ਕਾ ਢਬੁ ॥

Kaal Naahee Jog Naahee Naahee Sath Kaa Dtab ||

कालु नाही जोगु नाही नाही सत का ढबु ॥

No, no, this is not the time, when people know the way to Yoga and Truth.

28820 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੮

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਥਾਨਸਟ ਜਗ ਭਰਿਸਟ ਹੋਏ ਡੂਬਤਾ ਇਵ ਜਗੁ ॥੧॥

Thhaanasatt Jag Bharisatt Hoeae Ddoobathaa Eiv Jag ||1||

थानसट जग भरिसट होए डूबता इव जगु ॥१॥

The holy places of worship in the world are polluted, and so the world is drowning. ||1||

28821 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੮

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਕਲ ਮਹਿ ਰਾਮ ਨਾਮੁ ਸਾਰੁ ॥

Kal Mehi Raam Naam Saar ||

कल महि राम नामु सारु ॥

In this Dark Age of Kali Yuga, the Lord's Name is the most sublime.

28822 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੮

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਅਖੀ ਤ ਮੀਟਹਿ ਨਾਕ ਪਕੜਹਿ ਠਗਣ ਕਉ ਸੰਸਾਰੁ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

Akhee Th Meettehi Naak Pakarrehi Thagan Ko Sansaar ||1|| Rehaao ||

अखी त मीटहि नाक पकड़हि ठगण कउ संसारु ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥

Some people try to deceive the world by closing their eyes and holding their nostrils closed. ||1||Pause||

28823 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੯

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਆਂਟ ਸੇਤੀ ਨਾਕੁ ਪਕੜਹਿ ਸੂਝਤੇ ਤਿਨਿ ਲੋਅ ॥

Aaantt Saethee Naak Pakarrehi Soojhathae Thin Loa ||

आंट सेती नाकु पकड़हि सूझते तिनि लोअ ॥

They close off their nostrils with their fingers, and claim to see the three worlds.

28824 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੨ ਪੰ. ੧੯

ਮਗਰ ਪਾਛੈ ਕਛੁ ਨ ਸੂਝੈ ਏਹੁ ਪਦਮੁ ਅਲੋਅ ॥੨॥

Magar Paashhai Kashh N Soojhai Eaehu Padham Aloa ||2||

मगर पाछै कछु न सूझै एहु पदमु अलोअ ॥२॥

But they cannot even see what is behind them. What a strange lotus pose this is! ||2||

28825 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੧

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਖਤ੍ਰੀਆ ਤ ਧਰਮੁ ਛੋਡਿਆ ਮਲੇਛ ਭਾਖਿਆ ਗਹੀ ॥

Khathreeaa Th Dhharam Shhoddiaa Malaeshh Bhaakhiaa Gehee ||

खत्रीआ त धरमु छोडिआ मलेछ भाखिआ गही ॥

The K'shatriyas have abandoned their religion, and have adopted a foreign language.

28826 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੧

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਸਭ ਇਕ ਵਰਨ ਹੋਈ ਧਰਮ ਕੀ ਗਤਿ ਰਹੀ ॥੩॥

Srisatt Sabh Eik Varan Hoee Dhharam Kee Gath Rehee ||3||

स्रिसटि सभ इक वरन होई धरम की गति रही ॥३॥

The whole world has been reduced to the same social status; the state of righteousness and Dharma has been lost. ||3||

28827 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੨

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਅਸਟ ਸਾਜ ਸਾਜਿ ਪੁਰਾਣ ਸੋਧਹਿ ਕਰਹਿ ਬੇਦ ਅਭਿਆਸੁ ॥

Asatt Saaj Saaj Puraan Sodhhehi Karehi Baedh Abhiaas ||

असट साज साजि पुराण सोधहि करहि बेद अभिआसु ॥

They analyze eight chapters of (Panini's grammar and the Puraanas. They study the Vedas,

28828 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੨

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

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ਬਿਨੁ ਨਾਮ ਹਰਿ ਕੇ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਨਾਹੀ ਕਹੈ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਦਾਸੁ ॥੪॥੧॥੬॥੮॥

Bin Naam Har Kae Mukath Naahee Kehai Naanak Dhaas ||4||1||6||8||

बिनु नाम हरि के मुकति नाही कहै नानकु दासु ॥४॥१॥६॥८॥

But without the Lord's Name, no one is liberated; so says Nanak, the Lord's slave. ||4||1||6||8||

28829 ਧਨਾਸਰੀ (ਮ: ੧) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੬੬੩ ਪੰ. ੩

Raag Dhanaasree Guru Nanak Dev

After this Bani moves onto aarti.

It's far too easy to take one line out of bani and spin it to be something else. If you want to show respect to bani at-least read the external context. I'm not arguing about whatever frenzy you're worked up in. I just felt the need to point out that small fact.

Kira, bro, Jagsaw is a lost cause. He'd rather talk about his "Jattism" vs "Khatrism" over Guru Sahib's Sikhi.

[lsingh]

This post was about Modi's visit and the sellouts meeting him. It is so easy for Sikhs to go off in another direction and end up damaging their own cause.

[DailyMail]

It's bizarre that some on this forum are still discussing "sellouts" in london who wish to meet Modi, but fail to acknowledge the elephant in the room.....that the ol'chap who was awarded the Fakhr-e-Qaum (Mr Badal/Dhillon) has sold out the Sikh nation to the right-wing Hindu's!!!!!

Even if these Khatri businessmen hadn't been sellouts, then Badal's industrial-level selling out would've more than made up for it.

In the end, who cares if the Khatri businessmen meet Modi or not, when Mr Jatt has sold out the Sikh nation?

What a strange, strange, strange discussion indeed.