Question For Gusikhs/gurmukhs

[InderjitS]

This thread should be locked if it turns into my Sants better than yours and into a Ragmala debate. There are more threads on this topic that can be read in a lifetime on this forum and hundreds of internet pages spanning over 15+ years. The point is Ekta, do we want it or do we want to act like school children when our real enemies are laughing at us and constantly adding fuel to the fire??

[Koi]

That question can be applied the other way too, do you believe Bhai Randhir Singh was lying?

Honestly, I don’t understand why we need to have a division or be hateful over these minor differences. We should respect everyone regardless of our differences as long as there is no harm done to another.

To be honest, this is not a minor difference. Gurbani is never minor.

However, I do 1000% agree with the idea of mutual respect resulting in peace on both sides. We got bigger fish....eh.....potatoes to fry.

[singh_khalsa]

Also I want to make this clear incase these over the top pro raag mala ppl try to mislead the sangat, particularly the young innocent members.

The Guru roop Khalsa Panth, through Sri Akal Takht, decided a long time ago that it is upto to the individual sikh whether or not to read/believe in raag mala or not.

So it is legit, under the hukum of Khalsa panth, to either believe in Raag Mala or not to believe in it.

In the early days raag mala was not even read at akal takth sahib! only when a taksali became jathedaar did he change this marada without going through proper procedures of panthic approval. Even in Sant Jarnail Singh's time raag mala was not read. Infact a taksali singh read raag mala there and Sant jee ended up slapping him!! The reason was that Sant jee respected the akal takht marada and told the taksali to never impose his beliefs and marayda on akal takht again. Now imagine if Sant jee had a narrow immature mind like some people here? In that case sant jee would have praised the singh and started going on about how those who don't read raag mala are like ram rai. Instead Sant jee slapped him to preserve the supremecy of Akal takth!

These things are beyond the understaning of the likes of Singh123456777. These types create hatred in the panth becasue of their extreme views against those who don't believe in raag mala. I request the likes of Singh12345677 to try to be more like Sant jee and let go of your own cleverness.

Sangat jee, don't fall for their propaganda. Never place trust in ppl who are willing to burn puratan saroops of Guru Granth Sahib jee just because they don't contain raag mala. They are trying to destroy the puratan evidence. Not only are the guilty of maha beadbi of guru sahib (burning the saroops) they are basically destroying our historical treasures (the puratan saroops).

[DSGkeepingitreal]

http://www.tapoban.org/forum/read.php?1,1436,page=1

http://puratanjatha.blogspot.ca/2013/12/did-bhai-randhir-singh-really-not.html

http://www.tapoban.org/forum/read.php?1,6045

http://www.akj.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=3752

http://gurmatbibek.com/forum/read.php?3,24667

https://sikhunity.wordpress.com/2014/01/02/damdami-taksaal-akhand-kirtani-jatha/

http://gurmatbibek.com/forum/read.php?3,22651

[DSGkeepingitreal]

http://gurmatbibek.com/forum/read.php?3,6147

http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?/topic/69743-taksal-faction-under-dhummas-control-changes-gurbani/

[Guest]

Also I want to make this clear incase these over the top pro raag mala ppl try to mislead the sangat, particularly the young innocent members.

The Guru roop Khalsa Panth, through Sri Akal Takht, decided a long time ago that it is upto to the individual sikh whether or not to read/believe in raag mala or not.

So it is legit, under the hukum of Khalsa panth, to either believe in Raag Mala or not to believe in it.

In the early days raag mala was not even read at akal takth sahib! only when a taksali became jathedaar did he change this marada without going through proper procedures of panthic approval. Even in Sant Jarnail Singh's time raag mala was not read. Infact a taksali singh read raag mala there and Sant jee ended up slapping him!! The reason was that Sant jee respected the akal takht marada and told the taksali to never impose his beliefs and marayda on akal takht again. Now imagine if Sant jee had a narrow immature mind like some people here? In that case sant jee would have praised the singh and started going on about how those who don't read raag mala are like ram rai. Instead Sant jee slapped him to preserve the supremecy of Akal takth!

These things are beyond the understaning of the likes of Singh123456777. These types create hatred in the panth becasue of their extreme views against those who don't believe in raag mala. I request the likes of Singh12345677 to try to be more like Sant jee and let go of your own cleverness.

Sangat jee, don't fall for their propaganda. Never place trust in ppl who are willing to burn puratan saroops of Guru Granth Sahib jee just because they don't contain raag mala. They are trying to destroy the puratan evidence. Not only are the guilty of maha beadbi of guru sahib (burning the saroops) they are basically destroying our historical treasures (the puratan saroops).

It's like you guys make it seem that Raag Mala wasn't read since the 1600s but actually Raag Mala hasn't been read since 1945 in akal takhat sahib. Before 1945 there was dasam Granth sahib parkash in akal takhat!! It was parallel to Guru Granth Sahib Ji but you guys don't care much.

The anti Raag Mala crew is not infallible as well. In the 1900s they ripped out angs or blackened the ang with ink and did other beadbi to the ang and you think that only the pro Raag Mala people are bad? Grow up and look at both sides.

[Guest]

Those of have done agan bhet for that reason have no chance of being saved.

The most dangerous "sikhs" are in the pro rag mala group. You don't see those who don't believe in rag mala going after saroops with rag mala and setting the saroops on fire.

pure evil, they are enemies of Satguru who burn saroops to hide evidence of raag mala not being bani. Pro rag mala ppl believe in their particular sant and ignore all the scholarly ecidence. you can't reason with them. Then when they have no proof they come out with this sant has dib drishtee to know that this and that happened. Then at the point it's impossible to debate properly. Noone in modern times has greater dib drishti then Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh. His kmayee was just tooo much. Maha maha speical GurSikh!

Pure evil, they are the enemies who used to rip out or blacken the ang cause of pure hatred. It's actually the anti Raag Mala crew that rejects even listening to katha of Raag Mala. If you listen to katha of Raag Mala you might change your view. They call the bani diseased and a lot of the anti Raag Mala crew I know of say that whoever believes in Raag Mala are going to hell.

You talked about Ram Rai above.....let me ask you one thing....you're so focused on adding or removing even one word or page.....what are you going to say to those pro-Ragmala extremists who for the past 100 years have hunted down Puratan handwritten Saroops of Guru Granth Sahib Jee which DO NOT have Ragmala in them, and they do 'agan bhet' of those Saroops.

If adding or removing one word equates one to Ram Rai....then what would you call pro-Ragmala extremists?

I can ask the same question! What will happen to those who threw black ink on Raag Mala or ripped out Raag Mala? Look at it both ways.

[Kira]

I've seen quite a lot of stuff about the AKJ being thrown around. I admit im very ignorant on them as a whole, so can someone kindly fill me in on why there is negativity towards them. Obviously I'm not aware of the entire story so I am in no way commenting on anything, I would just like some info on it please. Thank you.

Apologizes if this is off topic.

[Guest]

That question can be applied the other way too, do you believe Bhai Randhir Singh was lying?

Honestly, I dont understand why we need to have a division or be hateful over these minor differences. We should respect everyone regardless of our differences as long as there is no harm done to another.

Minor difference? Again it is not a minor difference when gurbani is involved. If we are talking about if somebody is a sarbloh bibeki and a person who is not that is a minor difference.

[Guest]

In the end we can argue on for days and days and days until we become old but the anti Raag Mala brigade and the pro Raag Mala crew will not change their views. Let's agree to disagree because if we keep going on this track people will start slinging shite around and that's not helpful.