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Sangha Sahib, Which organisation did Dudley Council provide the grants to? Was it not the GNSS Dudley Committee who have been confidently running the Community centre and showing the income generated by the hall in their accounts submitted to Charity Commissions over the last few years? If the Dudley Council are stakeholders in this hall, are they on the management committee? Please provide the evidence that the council have said that the grants would only be given if the hall allowed meat and alcohol on the premises? Your total funds (Guru Ghar and Community Centre) were clearly pooled up into one set of accounts. It's only once the wider Sangat started enquiring that the GNSS Dudley Committee crafted a smoke screen of half truths to mislead the Sangat. http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/SHOWCHARITY/RegisterOfCharities/CharityWithoutPartB.aspx?RegisteredCharityNumber=502675&SubsidiaryNumber=0). Truth is the Truth, when it hurts then we call in "Slander". No one wants to upset a family and their happy occassion, but on top of that no Sikh wants the continuous abuse of using the Gurdwara Infrastructure as a means to attract funds from the Government for the devious purposes of making a Party Halls which allow manmat (anti Sikh activities). You're Sikhs of the Guru too. You know what is right and wrong. We're all accountable for our own actions in this world and beyond. Sangha Sahib, you're doing what you have convinced yourself if right but we are doing what we believe is right! I pray you understand why what you are doing is so hurtful to the Sikh Kaum one day.

Vaheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa! Vaheguroo Jee Kee Fateh! We have been working on a new app called iGurdwara. It is currently made for iOS (iPhone, iPod, iPad) and Android devices. It will be available on other devices (Blackberry, Windows Phone 7) soon. The app should be complete and submitted to the app store by 1st July 2011. However the android app, even though it is made shall not be released for a while, the reason being is because I haven't got an android device to test it on at this moment of time, and do need to test it for bugs/errors, screen sizes and etc. This app will locate the nearest Gurdwaras to you, so say you have gone to a different town/city, you can view the nearest gurdwaras to you. You can even search for Gurdwaras near a place before you go to that area. Each Gurdwara will get their own profile on the app, the Gurdwara's will be able to send people (if they wish to receive them) push notifications of the events to there local Gurdwara. So for example, if you wanted to stay up to date at what's happening at your gurdwara, you would subscribe to your local gurdwaras profile and every time they have an event you will get an update, for example if there is a camp happening at your local gurdwara, it will pop up on your screen letting you know there is a camp happening. You don't need to have the app open to receive these notifications. You can also listen to live audio from your local gurdwara if they have it, (if they dont have it and wish to have it then please contact me and we can set it up for you). Please view the video below for a quick demo of the app so far, please note it is not complete yet, however please give us feedback if you would like certain features added or if you want things changed in the app. Also please contact me if you would like to be a beta tester for this app and all future Sikhee based apps, we currently have 5 other apps in development which we shall give info on in due course, however if you would like to help out then please do let me know. Please view the below video, a better video shall be made soon once the final version of the app is made, the final video shall have a voice over and describe the app in full detail. (View pictures of the app on Facebook here: http://www.facebook....100002110308711 ) More info: http://www.TatKhalsa.com/apps/igurdwara/ So basically please give suggestions and criticize to the max to the app can be improved, also please submit new app ideas! Thanks! Vaheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa! Vaheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!

Here is how I think of the issue.If I recite till only 'jap' and mool mantr really is uptil 'nanak hosi bhi sach' then I'm missing out in a big way. On the other hand, if I recite till 'nanak hosi bhi sach' and mool mantr is uptil 'jap' then I'm reciting full mool mantr and 1 pauri of Jap Ji Sahib. Simple logic will tell you that reciting till 'nanak hosi bhi sach' makes more sense, if anything, then you will be doing abhyaas of mool mantr + first pauri of jap ji sahib.

ਚੋਰ ਕੀ ਹਾਮਾ ਭਰੇ ਨ ਕੋਇ ॥ चोर की हामा भरे न कोइ ॥ Cẖor kī hāmā bẖare na ko▫e. No one will take responsibility for a thief. ਚੋਰੁ ਕੀਆ ਚੰਗਾ ਕਿਉ ਹੋਇ ॥੧॥ चोरु कीआ चंगा किउ होइ ॥१॥ Cẖor kī▫ā cẖanga ki▫o ho▫e. ||1|| How can a thief's actions be good? ||1||

Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jeo Maharaj, offered in your lotus feet for 25th May are the following Jaaps seva by SikhSangat members: 2000 by Jaswinder Singh Veerji + His Singhni Ji + 270 by gup*270 Veerji + 50 by our Kaljugi Veerji + 200 other Jaaps Waheguru Waheguru Kirpa Karo Kirpa Karo Kirpa Karo on your beautiful Kaum jeo!

1013 modnote: Waheguru Dhan Guru dhan Guru Ke Pyaare Jaaps added!

Please don't be foolish enough to think it's womans fault that a man has thoughts of kaam. Guru Ji shunned this ridiculous notion assumed by muslims and stated men and women equal. In principle, this defacing of a poster is wrong, regardless of what was on the poster, a tyrannical act done by the taliban mentality of misguided muslims.

A coach is being organised from Singh Sabha Gurdwara, Cross Road, Coventry, to the rally on Saturday. If you would like to attend then please text/phone Jaskarn Singh on 07958040963 to confirm a seat on the coach by 8pm tonight! This is to make sure we have enough sangat to book a coach.

The family's party can easily be rescheduled to other local halls that are not related to our Guru Ghars. Not that I support the promotion of meat, sharab and parties, but if they are struggling for alternatives then there's a list I just found for them on a simple google search. At leat they don't have the paap of doing the Guru Ghar's beadbi if they move their party somewhere else Have the GNSS Dudley Committee kept the family in the loop in all this palaver or are the family in the dark? Perhaps Mr Medare or Mr Sangha can advise. Brierley Hill Civic Hall Bank Street, Brierley Hill, West Midlands, DY5 3DA 01384 812730 Dudley Wood Primary School Dudley Wood Road, Dudley, West Midlands, DY2 0DB 01384 818690 Dudley Leisure Centre Wellington Road, Dudley, West Midlands, DY1 Kingswinford Community Centre 425, High St, Kingswinford, West Midlands DY6 8AP 01384 273625 Gornal and Sedgley Labour Club 88 Clarence Street Dudley, West Midlands, DY3 1UP Sedgley Community Centre Ladywalk Sedgley Amblecote Scouts Hut School Drive Amblecote Stourbridge

waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh please add 216 for day before yesterday 216 for yesterday!!! thank you modnote: Waheguru Waheguru Waheguru, Dhanvaad Guru Swaare Jeo, jaaps added!

Ive just decided im attending the rally...after seeing this fOols posts (Mr Medare)....does anyone know if there is a coach going from southall for this protest or do we have to arrange our own transport?

For 24th May are the following Jaaps sevas jeo: 2000 Jaaps by Bhai Jaswinder Singh Ji + his Singhni Ji + 270 by gupt*270 Veerji + 50 by "Kaljugi" Veerji + 200 other Jaaps

Waheguru Jeo, some believe that sri mool mantar sahib is till gurparsad, while others are of the opinion its till hosi bhi sach.. but guru sahib is beant, follow any maryada ur heart wants to follow jeo. eventually every seva, be it jaaps or any other, is accepted in lotus feet of sri guruji maharaj provided its done with love and devotion, jinh prem keeyo tinh hi prabh paayeo :hug:

Oh my Vahiguroo. Our community really is in a pitiful state when we have the like of Mr Medare (and people like him in the Dudley committee) going to these extreme lengths to justify their passion for meat and alcohol in Gurdwara buildings. Sad state of affairs. Aman bhajee makes an important point - these dudley lot will be looking for any excuse to point fingers at the sangat. It is most important that the sangat maintains their discipline on the day, joining in with the simran, mool mantar, chaupai sahibs and kirtan.

Waheguru Jeo, your Jaaps have been added from your previous post About Sri Chaupai Sahib Jaaps, haanji if Sangat Ji orders such a thread be started then sevadars will def follow the Hukam jeo

513 please. Also will you be holding any programmes like the chapaui programmes to boost the count

Added for 23rd May are the following Jaaps Seva Waheguru jeo : 2000 Jaaps by Bhai Jaswinder Singh Ji + his Singhni Ji + 270 by gupt*270 Veerji + 50 by "Kaljugi" Veerji + 100 other Jaaps Tuhi Tuhi!

Sukhdev Singh Ji you have posted the same message about 5 times which we have had to delete, please don't just copy the same post again and again. As for this hall, you are claiming this hall is to pay for the Gurdwara, really if you are encouraging activites such as drinking, meat eating, dirty music and partying, whats the point of preserving the Gurdwara anyway if you are turning people away from Maharaj?

Sukhdev Singh ji. To you a gurdwara is a building with constitutions an clauses, just like a business. To the wider Gursikh sangat a Gurdwara is the house of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji where Gurmat principles are promoted. Dudley GNSS committee clearly dont have the gurmat to further progress Sikhi, oh but really know how to amend clauses and lie about ownership. That kind of Sikhi wont get you far...

It's a separate place, which is (or was, until very recently) owned and managed by the Gurdwara. You are trying to defend the indefensible. Does Akal Thakht not meaning anything to you and the rest of your Dudley committee?

Mr Medare, Can you please explain how "very good Sikhs" can allow the Sangat's money be used for promoting meat and alcohol? Where/how does Sikhi allow this? Why can't you accept that this practice has been outlawed by the highest authority for Sikhs?

please add 213 Jeo :waheguru: modnote: Dhanvaad Waheguru Jeo, Jaaps added

Also offerered in lotus feet of Sri Guruji Maharaj are the following sevas by SikhSangat members: 2000 Jaaps by Bhai Jaswinder Singh Ji + his Singhni Ji + 270 by gupt*270 Veerji + 50 by "Kaljugi" Veerji + 200 other Jaaps Tu Pir Gunvanthaa Hau Auganeyaara Main Nirgun Bakss Nanak Vecharaa Waheguru Jeo, Mehr Karo Mehr Karo Mehr Karo

VaheGuru Jee, Please add 1200 Jaaps ... Dhanvaad Jee modnote: Dhanvaad Phenjeo Your kamayee has been added to the khajana :happy: Waheguru Waheguru Waheguru Tuhi Tuhi!

please add 122 Jeo mod note: Dhanvaad Pyaare Veerjeo, jaaps have been added

waheguru plz add 1200 Hou Kai Salahee Karim Jant Vadi Teri Vadeyaee Modnote: Waheguru, Dhan Guru Dhan Guru Pyaare, jaaps added jeo

im such a moorakh, cuz i didnt do many jaaps plz add 10 jaaps modnote: Waheguru Waheguru Waheguru, Phenji your Jaaps have been added

Waheguru jeo, added for today are following jaaps seva by Sangat Jee: 2000 Jaaps by Jaswinder Singh Veerji and his family + 270 63 previously uncounted Jaaps by gupt*270 Veerji + 50 Jaaps seva by "Kaljugi" Veerji + 60 other Jaaps

10 modnote: Waheguru Jeo, your Jaaps have been added

Waheguru Jeo, added 108 Jaaps by a gupt Phenji :waheguru:

136 Ji :waheguru: modnote: Waheguru Jeo Dhanvaad Jaaps added jeo

216 please add,waheguru:) modnote: Dhanvaad Guru Ke Pyaareo, Jaaps added!

Waheguru jeo, added for today are following jaaps seva by Sangat Jee: 2000 Jaaps by Jaswinder Singh Veerji and his family 270 63 previously uncounted Jaaps by gupt*270 Veerji 50 Jaaps seva by "Kaljugi" Veerji 400 other Jaaps Guru Sahib Jeo Maharaj please bless your children with Naam Di Daat and keep us united always! tuhi tuhi! :happy:

Do be do parda Hai parda pardaie kaie pichaie....?

122 Ji :waheguru: modnote: Dhanvaad Waheguru jeo, jaaps added

108 ji bump modnote: sunny veerji! :D jaaps kamayee added! :hug: :happy:

gurfateh ji please add 62 jaaps Modnote: Dhanvaad phenjeo, your kamayee has been added :happy:

Waheguru Jeo, please accept the following Jaaps Seva by following Members: 2000 by Bhai Jaswinder Singh His Singhni Jee 207 by 207*gupt Guru Pyaare Jee 50 by "Kaljugi" Veerji 200 other Jaaps Dhan Guru Nanak Tuhi Nirankaar! :happy: Tuhi Tuhi!! Waheguru Waheguru!

Gurfateh:) 218 jaaps please !! modnote: Dhanvaad Waheguru Jeo, your kamayee has been added jeo :happy:

Thank you Prabhjot Singh jeo Dhanvaad modnote: :happy: :hug: :waheguru:

VaheGuru Jee, Please add 1100 ... Also wanted to know whether there was a deadline set in achieving 2 Million Jaaps? modnote: Dhanvaad Waheguru Jeo Jaaps added! :happy: About deadline, so far its open Jaaps but Sangat Jee can decide whether a deadline should be set

Gurfateh Veerjeo Haanji, a maala of 108 beads equals 108 Mool Mantar Sahib Jaaps jeo You can use also any other method of counting if you wish Some use their mobile phones for gupt counting, there are many counter apps available for iphone and android etc, or keep track of counts on tips of your fingers The only thing Guru Sahib Maharaj look at is the love with which we call His name, counting is just an aid for us humans jeo

Wjkk Wjkf, Can someone plz tell me how the mool mantar jaap is counted... So if I do 1 mool mantar mala of 108 beads is it equals to 108 times mool mantar. Im confused can someone tell me how its worked. Dhanvaad

so why make such statements initially. ? A sikh of the guru does not need scientific research, they just follow what the guru states.

I dont see a problem in wearing churrah its a cultural thing and a symbol of newly married woman ... i dont think how it affects you spirtualy ... if u cant go to gurdwara or read ur bani or do naam simren ... then wearing churah is wrong if it doesnt do that then it doesnt matter ... traditional punjabi women's dress was a ghagra ... one should ash her grandmother when she was young what women use to wear answer will be given ... suit comes from afgani and kashmiri people ... looking at the history suit can be classified as more a muslim women dress then a sikh women dress ... what ever u wear it doesnt matter it should be above the line ... lehngha saari or suit ... some one posted hukamanama of bhai daya singh may be whose ever translated it has more naam simren then bhai daya singh so he added word jwellery to it ... it calls shinghar thats make up ... wear simple makeup ... some people dont know what is make up they classify even kajal as makeup where history records mata ji use to put kajal even in the eyes of guru gobind singh ji ... jewellery yes its allowed it should also be in the line of not showing of ...

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh Sant Gurbachan Singh Ji Bhindranwale used to tell the following story during his diwans to the sangat: In Maharashtra, a state located on the western coast of India, district Ahmednagar at Sri Rampur on the banks of the Godavari river there was a village. On the outskirts of this village there was an Udasi sant who was known to the people of the village as Bawa Ji. Bawa Ji was blessed by Guru Sahib with the seva of a hand written Bir of Dhan Dhan Satguru Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj. This seva was performed by Bawa Ji with a lot of sharda and love. A few times the village would be flooded with water from the Godavari river which would destroy the villagers crops, homes and sometimes the villagers themselves. One time as the water levels began to rise and the village began to flood all the villagers went to the place where Bawa Ji stayed and with folded hands did a benti to him to help save them. Bawa Ji got up and performed an ardas infront of Satguru Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj with a lot of prem and sharda. He then placed Maharaj on his head and began to walk in the direction of the flooded village. All the sangat who had gathered followed him. When he got to the village Bawa Ji with Maharaj placed on his head then stood in the water. A few moments later the water began to recede. In this way every time the village flooded an ardas would be done to Satguru Ji to save the village with their beautiful charan kamal and every time Maharaj would. This sakhi is especially relevant to Sikhs like me who fail to see Dhan Dhan Dhan Dhan Dhan Dhan Dhan Dhan Satguru Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj for what they really are (See below). Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

ਮਹਿਮਾ ਕਹੀ ਨ ਜਾਇ ਗੁਰ ਸਮਰਥ ਦੇਵ ॥ Mahimā kahī na jā▫e gur samrath ḏev. The Glory of the all-powerful Divine Guru cannot be described. ਗੁਰ ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਪਰਮੇਸੁਰ ਅਪਰੰਪਰ ਅਲਖ ਅਭੇਵ ॥੧੬॥ Gur pārbarahm parmesur aprampar alakẖ abẖev. ||16|| The Guru is the Supreme Lord God, the Transcendent Lord, infinite, unseen and unknowable. ||16|| Vaheguroo! Dhan Dhan Sargun Nirankar Sri Satguroo Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj Dhan Dhan Sargun Vaheguru Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj!

Dear Namstang, I won’t argue too much since it doesn’t relate to Gurmat but think logically and scientifically. First of all, original hand written copy of hanuman does not exist. If it does then it must be verified through scientific ways. Also, from what period to what period did he live? In what area? For how long? What about his descendents, relatives or monkeys who looked like him? Where are they now? Surely, one cannot simply say they all went extinct. Bhai Kahan Singh is simply stating what hindus believe. It doesn’t mean he himself believes in such mythology. If you want to know what he believes in then read Gurmat Sudhakar and other books in which he does not even mention hanuman showing up in 1699. If we believe the story then we must agree that hanuman was alive when valmick wrote ramayan which was 10,000 years before rama was born. So hanuman must have been a grown man during valmick, then lived for 10,000 years and then helped rama. So his total age gets well over 10,000 years. This is scientifically impossible. Also, all scholars agree that Hinduism is not older than 4000 years which itself rules out existence of hanuman. Besides, Ayodheya is only 2600 years old and proof of rama’s existence has been refuted. Archeological evidence and research records of 1951 and 1978 all conclude that Ayodheya was built by Buddhists and used to be a Buddhist center. Hand written accounts of Chinese travelers (about 1600 years old) all relate ayodheya to Buddhism. Hindus showed up much later. Many rayamans were written before valmick which suggest that rama was born in Varanasi. So Hinduism is 4000 years old and ayodheya is 2600 years old. Where do rama and hanuman fit in? No where. Then we come to hanuman’s life. There is no ancient life account written of hanuman. What we know is he was born and right after birth swallowed sun. He was son of air and his mother became pregnant without any sexual intercourse. All of this is simply ridiculous. According to Gurbani ਮਾ ਕੀ ਰਕਤੁ ਪਿਤਾ ਬਿਦੁ ਧਾਰਾ ॥ ਮੂਰਤਿ ਸੂਰਤਿ ਕਰਿ ਆਪਾਰਾ ॥ From the union of the mother's egg and the father's sperm, the form of infinite beauty has been created. You may believe in other ways but Gurbani does not suggest any other way which is why Guru Sahib taught us to live Gristhi Jeevan so that humanity continues to exist. So, then we skip 10,000 years of hanuman and he is with rama helping him cross the ocean. You mentioned a copy of Hriday Ram. It was not written by hanuman and just because someone wrote a book on mythical character does not automatically prove its existence. Hriday Ram’s copy is around 400 years old but hanuman lived thousands of years ago. Guru Sahib is a great poet and he took a deep interest in translating the literature in a unique way. He translated Krishna Avtar, Chaubis Avtar, Chandi Di Vaar etc but doesn’t mean He believed in all this. The purpose was to translate not to revere these characters or deities. Puratan birs of Dasam Granth all vary. Not every copy has the same content. It was only at the end of 19th century that Sikhs gave it the form that we have today. Clearly, hanuman natak was excluded which is only found in some copies. Had it been work of Guru Sahib, Sikhs would’ve kept it. Chaupa Singh’s rehatnama also mentions all the banis Guru Sahib wrote and hanuman natak is not part of it. Now we come to the story of kachera. Establishing Khalsa was Hukam of Waheguru and planned by Guru Sahib. None of the historic records mention the story of hanuman. What year did hanuman show up? In what form? Why such an important event is not mentioned in 41 Vaar, Gur Sobha, Bhatt Vahis, Account of Bhai Jeevan Singh Ji etc. This story became popular during Arya Samaj which was refuted by Giani Ditt Singh. It is unfortunate that Sant mandalee has resorted to relate every major Sikhi event to Hinduism. Bhai Gurdas Ji is avtar of Ganesha, Darbar Sahib is ancient hindu place where 7 hindu sadhus did bhagtee and hanuman buried rest of sanjeevani booti, karah parsad was prepared by hindu gods, ingredients of amrit were brought by hindu deities, kachera was given by hanuman and all Panj Pyare were avtars of hindu gods and bhagats blah blah blah. This is clearly an attack on Sikhi and surely RSS would be very proud of such Sikhs. Why couldn’t there be an avtar from Christianity, Buddhism, Judaism, Shinto, Taoism, Shamanism, Islam etc? It won’t be long before every Shaheeds is labeled as avtar of some previous hindu deity. Some AKJ believe Bhai Fauja Singh was reincarnate of Baba Deep Singh Ji. Sanatanis would probably go a step further and declare all shaheeds to be avtars of parsuram, prehlad, dhroo, vishist, vyas, lachman, five pandavas etc. You may blindly follow Sants and take everything they said to be true but Sikhi is a way of life and can only survive if we follow Gurmat not hindu mythology.

These swords depict nothing , atleast not that Guru hargobind jee worship Kali. You know that i want to buy Katana , if it contains some japnese inscription it doesnt make me Budhist. And what is authenticity that these are same swords of Guru, as all our Gurudwaras were used by Brahmins upto 1922. Why are all nihangs so eager to worship kali? Do you think that there is Goddess kali really existing? is she servant of Akal? If we can worship Akal then what is use of worshipping any of his servant? Just which other Hindu Gods nihangs respect, ? Shiv,ganesh,parvati,lingaraja,nainadevi, i dont know much you can tell more. How can sikh allows such things to mix up with our rich traditions and history. Please can anyone tell where Guru nanak dev jee say about kali. If Guru Granth sahib says all ram, Krishan are just servants of Akal, then why are sikhs still want to respect them? They have not even find god. There is line that shiv is still looking for Brahamgiyani in sukhmani sahib. So why are we so much concerned about mythologically Hindu Gods that are totally rejected as worshippable in sikhi.

if u read artee by guru je they tell us wat the tru artee is vaaaheguru there is no need for little devai the entire universe is doing his artee guru e teaches us the tru way of artee bhula chuka maf