Why was Jathedar Baba Sahib Singh ji Kicked Out?

[NaamTiharoJoJape]

On 7/4/2021 at 3:35 AM, chatanga1 said:

 

Let's look at WHY the SIngh Sabha wanted to take over Sri Akal Bunga first.

 

IN the 1920s when 2nd Singh Sabha Lehar started, low caste people, esp Churre and Chamars, were NOT allowed to enter the Parikarma of Darbar Sahib because of their caste. The management (pre SGPC) were enforcing this. Low castes had to do namishkar from the steps and go back.

 

What kind of nonsense is this in the holiest place in the world?

 

The Singh Sabha wanted to end this as they did an enormous amount of parchar amongst low castes and brought thousands into Sikhi. However the British backed management of Darbar Sahib would not allow them in. Guess who was either supporting the management, or at the very least allowing it to happen? The same Nihangs you are talking about.

 

How on earth is this Gurmat? By those whoare supposed to be the custodians of Sikhi?

 

When the Singh Sabha had wrested control of Darbar Sahib from the British stooges, they moved to the next important shrine in the complex - Sri Akal Takht Sahib.

 

You have to ask yourself, why did the nihangs let such manmat happen in there.

apparently many also agree that post British conquest, and when Baba Prehlaad SIngh jee returned to Panjab, Anandpur became the new center of Budha Dal rather than Akaal bunga

british sources say about 500-600 Akali nihangs were present at Sri Akal Thakt (from times of Ranjit Singh's raj)

now imagining even a weaker stronghold of akalis, not sure if they could have done much either way other lose their lives 

 

[dallysingh101]

On 4/20/2021 at 7:14 PM, intrigued said:

Idk anything on shastr pooja is it right to do? Also what is it?

I think it was a normal Khalsa practice:

 

[Singh1989]

Well, I would assume he was spiritually high, really up there with jeevan?? 

[NaamTiharoJoJape]

On 7/7/2021 at 3:11 AM, dallysingh101 said:

I think it was a normal Khalsa practice:

 

hanji, its been months since this topic, shastar seem to be regarded as mahakaal or shakti saroop of parmesur 

following comes from bhai jivanpal singhs page 

 

This translation from Gurbilas Patshahi 6 describes the first time Sri Guru Hargobind Sahib Ji sat upon the timeless throne, Sri Akaal Takhat Sahib, and the Hukam of Akaal Purakh at the time:

ਤਖ਼ਤ ਬੰਦਨਾ ਕਰਿ ਮਨੁ ਲਾਈ। ਬੈਠੇ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਨਿਕਟਿ ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਈ॥੪੮॥
Guru Ji bowed down to Sri Akal Takhat Sahib with devotion, and sat beside the Takhat (i.e. out of respect Guru Ji did not sit on top of the throne of Akaal Purakh).

ਭਗਵੰਤ ਕਹਾ ਯਾ ਪਰਿ ਪਗ ਧਾਰੋ। ਬੈਠਿ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਨਿਜ ਸਤ੍ਰੂ ਮਾਰੋ।
Akaal Purakh said, "Sit upon the throne and destroy the tyrants!"

ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰ ਕਹਿ ਹਮ ਤੁਮਰੇ ਦਾਸ। ਹਮ ਕੋ ਸੇਵਾ ਬਨੇ ਅਰਦਾਸਿ॥੪੯॥
Guru Hargobind Ji said, "O Vaheguru, I am your servant, it only befits me to supplicate in front of you!"

ਦੋਹਰਾ॥ ਕਹਿ ਭਗਵੰਤ ਨਿਜ ਮੋਹਿ ਮੈ ਭੇਦ ਕਛੂ ਨਹਿ ਚੀਨ।
Akaal Purakh said, "Do not recognise any difference between me and you"

ਅਕਾਲ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਯਹ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਰਿ ਤੋਹਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਨਹਿ ਕੀਨ॥੫੦॥
"This Takhat has been named after Akaal (the Timeless One) and no one else" (i.e. Only Akaal Purakh and the Guru who is the form of Akaal Purakh can sit upon the Throne)

ਚੌਪਈ॥ ਜਬ ਲਗੁ ਤੁਮਰੀ ਦੇਹ ਰਹਾਵੋ। ਤਬ ਲਗੁ ਤੁਮ ਯਾ ਪਰਿ ਛਬਿ ਪਾਵੋ।
Akaal Purakh said, "As long as you are in bodily form, you should sit on the Throne in all your glory"

ਪਾਛੇ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਰੂਪ ਮਮ ਜਾਨੋ। ਮਮ ਪੂਜਾ ਇਹ ਠਾਂ ਠਾਨੋ॥੫੧॥
"Afterwards, recognise the Shastar (weapons) as my very form. To worship me place the Shastar on this Takhat". - ਗੁਰਬਿਲਾਸ ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹੀ ੬, ਅਧਿਆਇ ੮

Heeding the instructions of Akaal Purakh, Sri Guru Hargobind Sahib Ji ascended upon the throne of Akaal Purakh, to deliver justice and spread the path of righteousness. After Sri Guru Hargobind Sahib Ji left their physical form, the Shastars of Guru Sahibs, Gursikhs and Shaheed Singhs adorn Akaal Purakh Ji's Takhat as their physical form to this very day. This Takhat is of Akaal, no worldly force can destroy the Takhat (throne) of Nirankaar Akaal Purakh.

[NaamTiharoJoJape]

On 7/7/2021 at 9:22 AM, Singh1989 said:

Well, I would assume he was spiritually high, really up there with jeevan?? 

hanji, he must have been named "kaladhari" by the panth for some reason right? 

its just one of those instances in history where there are two opposing sides and its hard to imagine either one of them being in the grave wrong like baba banda singh bahadur and tat khalsa on top of how loosely documented these events are we cant even be sure about the authenticity of these events since it can be outside forces trying to create schisms within panth but it seems to play into a theme throughout our itihas of somewhat reformist vs. traditionalists where reformists end up being more dominant and glorified than the others (maharaja ranjit singh and akali panth, sgpc and akali panth, etc.) 

[dallysingh101]

18 minutes ago, NaamTiharoJoJape said:

hanji, its been months since this topic, shastar seem to be regarded as mahakaal or shakti saroop of parmesur 

following comes from bhai jivanpal singhs page 

 

This translation from Gurbilas Patshahi 6 describes the first time Sri Guru Hargobind Sahib Ji sat upon the timeless throne, Sri Akaal Takhat Sahib, and the Hukam of Akaal Purakh at the time:

ਤਖ਼ਤ ਬੰਦਨਾ ਕਰਿ ਮਨੁ ਲਾਈ। ਬੈਠੇ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਨਿਕਟਿ ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਈ॥੪੮॥
Guru Ji bowed down to Sri Akal Takhat Sahib with devotion, and sat beside the Takhat (i.e. out of respect Guru Ji did not sit on top of the throne of Akaal Purakh).

ਭਗਵੰਤ ਕਹਾ ਯਾ ਪਰਿ ਪਗ ਧਾਰੋ। ਬੈਠਿ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਨਿਜ ਸਤ੍ਰੂ ਮਾਰੋ।
Akaal Purakh said, "Sit upon the throne and destroy the tyrants!"

ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰ ਕਹਿ ਹਮ ਤੁਮਰੇ ਦਾਸ। ਹਮ ਕੋ ਸੇਵਾ ਬਨੇ ਅਰਦਾਸਿ॥੪੯॥
Guru Hargobind Ji said, "O Vaheguru, I am your servant, it only befits me to supplicate in front of you!"

ਦੋਹਰਾ॥ ਕਹਿ ਭਗਵੰਤ ਨਿਜ ਮੋਹਿ ਮੈ ਭੇਦ ਕਛੂ ਨਹਿ ਚੀਨ।
Akaal Purakh said, "Do not recognise any difference between me and you"

ਅਕਾਲ ਤਖ਼ਤ ਯਹ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਰਿ ਤੋਹਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਨਹਿ ਕੀਨ॥੫੦॥
"This Takhat has been named after Akaal (the Timeless One) and no one else" (i.e. Only Akaal Purakh and the Guru who is the form of Akaal Purakh can sit upon the Throne)

ਚੌਪਈ॥ ਜਬ ਲਗੁ ਤੁਮਰੀ ਦੇਹ ਰਹਾਵੋ। ਤਬ ਲਗੁ ਤੁਮ ਯਾ ਪਰਿ ਛਬਿ ਪਾਵੋ।
Akaal Purakh said, "As long as you are in bodily form, you should sit on the Throne in all your glory"

ਪਾਛੇ ਸ਼ਸਤ੍ਰ ਰੂਪ ਮਮ ਜਾਨੋ। ਮਮ ਪੂਜਾ ਇਹ ਠਾਂ ਠਾਨੋ॥੫੧॥
"Afterwards, recognise the Shastar (weapons) as my very form. To worship me place the Shastar on this Takhat". - ਗੁਰਬਿਲਾਸ ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹੀ ੬, ਅਧਿਆਇ ੮

Heeding the instructions of Akaal Purakh, Sri Guru Hargobind Sahib Ji ascended upon the throne of Akaal Purakh, to deliver justice and spread the path of righteousness. After Sri Guru Hargobind Sahib Ji left their physical form, the Shastars of Guru Sahibs, Gursikhs and Shaheed Singhs adorn Akaal Purakh Ji's Takhat as their physical form to this very day. This Takhat is of Akaal, no worldly force can destroy the Takhat (throne) of Nirankaar Akaal Purakh.

Awesome read!

[Singh1989]

23 minutes ago, NaamTiharoJoJape said:

hanji, he must have been named "kaladhari" by the panth for some reason right? 

its just one of those instances in history where there are two opposing sides and its hard to imagine either one of them being in the grave wrong like baba banda singh bahadur and tat khalsa on top of how loosely documented these events are we cant even be sure about the authenticity of these events since it can be outside forces trying to create schisms within panth but it seems to play into a theme throughout our itihas of somewhat reformist vs. traditionalists where reformists end up being more dominant and glorified than the others (maharaja ranjit singh and akali panth, sgpc and akali panth, etc.) 

Well, there you go then! He was high in Sikhi Jeevan hence he got kicked out. 

[NaamTiharoJoJape]

27 minutes ago, dallysingh101 said:

Awesome read!

careful khalsa ji, missionaries are going cancel you because the gurbilas granths are granths of bahminvaad written by  vidwaans of brahmin lineage  

[dallysingh101]

2 minutes ago, NaamTiharoJoJape said:

careful khalsa ji, missionaries are going cancel you because the gurbilas granths are granths of bahminvaad written by  vidwaans of brahmin lineage  

You're lucky to be born now. I spent decades in an environment where the above was the normal way of thinking. At least I can read Gurmukhi now and make up my own mind!

I think that retarded way of thinking about ithihhasik granths that doesn't conform to 'modren Sikhism' is weakening.

[GurjantGnostic]

On 7/4/2021 at 3:35 AM, chatanga1 said:

Worhsip of weapons. It is mentioned in old Sikh texts and is still practiced by Dal Panth. If I'm not mistaken the shastar pooja day falls one day after Diwali.

When without a Saroop a Shastar takes it place as well, for Matha Tek. Etc.